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Unread 03-11-2009, 12:38 PM   #1
mo5495
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Default Making things worse?

Husband did really good until New Years. He went almost 2 months without a drink. Since New Years it is better than it used to be but still not great. I was dealing with it all until this last Saturday. He went to the store to by an 18 pack, and drank 3 before I went to bed. I woke up at 3am. He was in the hot tub with another beer. I checked the fridge (I mark the bottom of the cans so I can see how many he drinks...trust issues...go figure). Apparently he had gone to the store after I went to bed and bought a 6 pack to add to the beer in the fridge so it would look like he only had a few. I've been waiting for the next shoe to drop for a while now and boy did it hit. Now I have no trust when it comes to him and am questioning how much he really has been drinking since New Years. I wrote a letter to him expressing my feelings and asking him to go together to the counselor on Friday and that just pissed him off. He is mad because I didn't talk to him before now. He "has the right to be talked to..." We are supposed to talk tonight about this. Am I making things worse by confronting him?
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Unread 03-11-2009, 01:35 PM   #2
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In my opinion you are not making things worse by confronting him. I believe an alcoholic (to me it sounds as though he may be or soon will be powerless over alcohol) should be confronted by their loved ones. However, the disease of alcoholism can destroy the alcoholic, as well as those who love him. Be aware of this. Confront him about his drinking, even if it pisses him off. Don't confront him if you sense he may become violent. (My loved ones confronted me about my drinking and I remember being really pissed off, but today I am glad they did).

It is really difficult for one to see when rational confrontation becomes irrational behavior on the part of the loved one. Remember, drinking problems (alcoholism) affects not just the drinker, but those who care also. This is why I strongly recommend Al Anon. I believe that Al Anon helps a person see the difference between healthy love for the drinker and the possible insanity that can result from a loved one going too far. best wishes to you and your husband........ Dave
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Unread 03-12-2009, 12:29 PM   #3
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Mo-

I understand everything you are going through. My husband is the same way. He tried to hide his drinking, which makes me mad because how stupid does he think I am? Confronting him in the wrong word - you are going to talk with him about your concerns. One thing I am trying to do is detach myself from his addition. I have been talking to him about it until I am blue in the face - it does NO good. It will make you feel better to get it all out with him, so say everything you need to say. Then it is in his hands. He has to see he has a problem and pointing it out to him too much will cause him to concentrate on your anger, not HIS addiction. The fact that he went out and bought more to hide it is a problem - tell him you know he did it and that if he doesn't see that as a drinking problem, then nothing you say will convince him. I am so in the same shoes as you. I am through talking to him about it though. He knows my feelings and now I am waiting to see what my next step will be. I hope your talk with your husband goes well and let us know how you're doing.

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Unread 03-12-2009, 02:00 PM   #4
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Hi Mo,

Ditto on all of the feedback- I think you have every right to discuss this with him. Maybe encourage him to try something new by way of support and help. Sometimes it is just not as easy as putting the drink down, yes you remove the alcohol but there may be other issues that need to be dealt with, drinking is sometimes just One variable in the equation.

Good luck and I think counseling is a great start. Please keep us posted. take care, Carly
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Unread 03-12-2009, 02:03 PM   #5
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Mo

You absolutley need to talk to him. What do you have to lose? Strange he thinks the letter was not a good option, though. If talking was important to him, shouldn't he have come to you with the drinking? That could be played both way. Either way, the letter opened up some much needed dialogue and I hope it goes well.

Remember, he will most likely be defensive and try to twist 'facts' to make everyone else look guilty or responsible. Hold your ground. Please let us know how it goes.

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Unread 03-13-2009, 11:31 AM   #6
mo5495
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I talked to him Wednesday night. He wanted to know how I found out about his hiding the beer. Then he proceeded to tell me he wanted to "twist off" the night he did it but didn't feel like he could ask me. Ask me? Who does he think I am? Anyways, I called bulls**t and told him that I understand that I can't control his drinking. He said "OK" (with the excitement of a 5 year old on Christmas morning). He did agree to go to the counselor with me as he felt that he was getting nothing out of his individual sessions.
So, after that conversation, I knew he was going to try to push my buttons. I was right. I was gone for 2 1/2 hours last night. During that time, he did it again. There were two unmarked beers in the fridge, so he had a total of 10 beers during that time. I didn't call him out on it when I got home because that was what he was looking for. I go to the counselor today. Thank God!
I just want to rip his head off for acting like a kid!!!
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Unread 03-14-2009, 09:03 PM   #7
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Mo,
Stop counting his beers. Now that he knows he will make a game of it and seek to push your buttons.
And by all means let him know how you feel about his drinking but try not to get into a verbal tennis match. You don't need to hear his explanations or I should say his rationalizations.
I'm curious, has there been any significant life changes or stressful situations since the new year? Just curious.
Jerry
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Unread 03-17-2009, 10:28 AM   #8
mo5495
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The only changes since New Years have been our marriage. I have been working on it more than ever. Sometimes I feel that I am the only one working on it. The only other thing is he has a lump at the base of his skull causing severe headaches. I have pleaded with him to go have it checked out. I think he is scared of what he might learn.

As for counting the beers, I know it is stupid but it seems like I can't stop myself...almost like I have the addiction. It seems like the only control I have over his drinking is to see how much he is drinking. I will try to stop!!!
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Unread 03-17-2009, 03:41 PM   #9
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Hi Mo,

You seem to understand something that few people realize. You stated, " ...... almost like have the addiction". This disease, problem drinking, etc., affects the whole family, not just the one drinking. Don't let this disease progress any further. Seek help through Al Anon or through links provided by people interested in you. Please remember, you never will be able to control his drinking. It is not stupid (IMO) to count his beers. It is a sign of how alcoholism can and will take you along the path of destruction.. Harsh words yes, but true. Take care, Dave
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Unread 03-18-2009, 02:00 AM   #10
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Mo,
What you describe is an odd thing that happens to those close to an addicted person. You are addicted to the behavior, his behavior. The counting of the beers. Yes you must stop. But you need to see how this happens. It is a matter of control, and it may be occurring in other areas of your relationship as well, unknowingly to you. It can be just as sick as the drinking. Dave pointed that out very clearly.

Have you looked around the site? Are you getting an idea of your options around what you are dealing with?
Have you been in contact with any sort of help with your situation locally?
Do you have anyone to talk to about this? I echo Dave's advice and add you could talk with your family doctor. Right now it is important you educate yourself.
Here are some places you can start.
Let us know what you think.

All the best,
Jerry


http://www.alcoholanswers.org/alcoho...-questions.cfm

http://www.alcoholanswers.org/treatm...ns/default.cfm
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Unread 09-05-2009, 11:56 AM   #11
mo5495
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I have not been to the site in awhile. I quit counting beers (well...documenting at least...). I was aware of how much he drank and that he would still sneak a six pack into the drawer of beers to make it seem that he hadn't been drinking as much. Things had been going well until the middle of August. Our anniversary night, we went to dinner and then to a local theater performance. He drank so much that I had to drive home, then he passed out. Fun times!!! Since that night, he has only gone two nights without a beer and only because he ran out. I've learned to exist with him. Not live...exist. Am I enabling him by not confronting him?
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Unread 09-05-2009, 02:12 PM   #12
CarlyO
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Dear Mo,
I am glad you posted though sorry under these circumstances. When you mentione things had been going well, can you elaborate on that ? Was he controlling his alcohol intake, were you happier , at peace ?

You ask are you enabling him by not confronting him ?

My opinion : One of the toughest things we face is confronting our loved ones about their alcohol issues but unless you want to continue living like this, someone needs to make a move , something has to change, if he knows he can continue drinking and that you are willing to "exist " what incentive does he ever have to step back and assesss his drinking and more importantly what it is doing to YOU and your feelings?

You mention that you " Exist with him - not live, " does this extend to your life overall ? - are you merely existing ? either way, is this acceptable to you ?
Have you gone back and read the threads by 1418, Idol, Nove/Tina and Mary Ellen and others ? They all faced similar situations, maybe this would provide insight into what your options are.

In addition to the feedback you have already recieved, having a plan in place is vital if you do choose to confront him. And you know it is best to not confront him if he has been drinking.

Another option if you are unsure the best way to proceed, is to seek professional help, a counselor, or try Al Anon.
In the mean time I think reading back through the other threads may be helpful.
I read back and saw this posted by Jerry ....
""Mo,
And by all means let him know how you feel about his drinking but try not to get into a verbal tennis match. You don't need to hear his explanations or I should say his rationalizations. "" Orig Post by Jerry

Mo, I hope this helps, I am sure others will stop by and post, again, glad you posted and we are for you ... Take care, Carly
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Unread 09-05-2009, 03:35 PM   #13
Magda
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From reading all of your posts, it would be difficult to be exact but it sounds like your husband is a binge drinker.He has periods of abstinence or close to it- then has periods of compulsive drinking.How long are you willing to take it? How long are you willing to let his illness control your life? Only you can decide, and when you do decide to lay it out for him- don't threaten to do anything unless you intend on following through.Many people tell their spouses that if they drink anymore, they will leave and never intended on doing so.If you are not sure, don't say anything because eventually your husband may ignore your plea when you mean it most!
I am glad you stopped counting his beers, doing so will change nothing.When people are alcoholics, they are in denial so chances are you will never get a straight answer out of him.The quantity of alcohol is nowhere near as important as what the effects of drinking it are for him.
Look deep within yourself and find what you really want for your future.Start a journal and see a counselor or attend Al Anon.Having support from others that understand is vital to you, give some new things a chance! Best to you!
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Unread 09-05-2009, 11:24 PM   #14
R. Lee
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Mo, Some good advice from the above posts. Good luck, R. Lee
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Unread 09-15-2009, 12:08 PM   #15
mo5495
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My version of how things were better is that we weren't fighting constantly. Now it has turned into "existing". I think he is happier since I have not been confronting him every day. Problem is, now he thinks that everything is ok, his drinking, his behavior, etc. I feel like I have quit living. I still do things with the kids, still work, etc. When I get home, it's the same old thing. I wait to see how long it takes him to pop open the first beer, then fume because he did. I feel like I'm exploding inside my head but outside I try to remain calm so that there is no arguing. The arguing really bothered my 14 year old. Even now, my son will see dad having more than a couple of beers and take off to his bedroom so he doesn't have to watch Dad get drunk or Mom get mad.
To top it off, I find myself seeing signs of behavior that is probably not even there. My husband and I have not been intimate as much as he would like. Big surprise there. From what I have read here, that's pretty common. I think he might be having a flirtatious fling with his boss. All I hear is about how pretty "J"'s eyes are, how much fun "J" is, how much alike he and "J" are. They have sent texts to each other which he promptly deletes from his phone. She is a big drinker too so I'm sure that's why she seems so fun to him, while I am the boring nag.
Wow, I didn't realize I had that much anger until I started typing. Maybe that's why this is so comforting. I can vent without being told I'm nagging. Thanks for listening.
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Unread 09-15-2009, 01:27 PM   #16
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Hello,

Unfortunately I don't have any words of wisdom for you, except I really encourage you to keep posting on this board. I think you will find it extremely useful and you are correct, it is a very safe place to vent. One of the biggest lessons I learned from this site is to trust my instincts, which is difficult to do when living with an alcoholic. The manipulation and mind games can make a person doubt him/herself.

Have you thought about counseling at all? It isn't for everyone, but I found it very useful. I am concerned about you. Going numb can be a coping mechanism, but unless I am misinterpreting your post - I dont' think you want to live that way. Your kids may pick up on that as well, and you seem like a good mother, so you will want to be emotionally available to support your kids.

Hang in there. Even when things seems like there isn't a path to a better life, there is. Sometimes it is staying with the alcoholic and learning different coping mechanisms, sometimes it is leaving. There isn't any one right answer, but you seem to have recognized that going numb really isn't a long term solution for you. A counselor or Al-Anon may be a safe venue to come out of being numb. I have always been told that a person will become numb when everything is too much to handle, becuase it is better than feeling the real emotion.

Take care,
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Unread 09-15-2009, 03:43 PM   #17
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mo, I'm a recovering alcoholic. When I drank I always thought of my wants 1st. I lived a me, me, & more me's kind of life. I lived a life of a selfish, self serving person. All the pleading in the world did not matter to me.

You are probably right about his boss. Drunks like to cry on each other's shoulders. This may have turned into a relationship or he could just be playing with your mind. It will all come out in the wash.

Remember you have choices. You don't have to live like this.

Thank you for posting & keep coming back for support. Others here have given you some great suggestions. R. Lee
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Unread 09-15-2009, 09:49 PM   #18
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Mo I am worried about you too. It sounds like you are bone tired of dealing with this and to add insult to injury you are enduring that business with his boss.
Not that this is an excuse, but if he is drinking, his boundaries may skewed or non -existent.

I think even family members have to hit their rock bottom before they will take action. For me, my loved one, I sought help through a therapist - until I had a plan in place.

I hope you will consider some type of support, counseling, Al Anon, do you have a close friend or family member to talk to ? or is this not something you would not do ?

Either way, We are here for you, vent, let it out!! I imagine you have many feelings surrounding his drinking, something's gotta give at some point. yes?

Mo, please keep us posted, we're here for you. Take care, Carly
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Unread 09-18-2009, 10:27 AM   #19
mo5495
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I have made an appointment with the counselor that I had been seeing before. I have also checked into AlAnon meetings in my area. I am determined to fix myself. I have to do this for me and my sons.
My husband and I will be going to a wedding for one of his former co-workers tomorrow night. I just found out that there will be alcohol there. My first thought was to say we shouldn't go, but I know he'll just go without me. I would rather he make it home safely so I guess I'll go too.
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Unread 09-18-2009, 07:08 PM   #20
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It is really good to hear that you are going back to your counselor, do you feel they were helpful in the past? Do they specialize in addiction issues? Al Anon is good for you also, just GO. You have started to take important steps to improving your quality of life, don't forget how you feel about what your husband has put you and your children through. You may not be able to make him want to change, but you can change YOU. Your family deserves better.
It is amazing that just because alcohol is legal, people don't see how damaging it is or just don't care. Just hearing you tell us about the texts from his boss infuriates me.Of course, it's the alcohol- whatever.I am sorry you are having troubles, just keep your head up and keep working on you.
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Unread 09-19-2009, 11:21 AM   #21
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Mo,

So glad you are going to take positive steps for yourself and your children. You deserve a better quality of life than merely existing.


By seeking help for yourself, I think you will find the comfort, strength and wisdom to make positive changes in your life. Hang in there, Take Care Mo,
Carly
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Last edited by CarlyO; 09-19-2009 at 11:43 AM.. Reason: spelling
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Unread 09-22-2009, 01:12 PM   #22
mo5495
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I know now more than ever that I need help for my children. My 14 year old son told me yesterday that he is concerned about his father's drinking and that he worries every day that he will end up a "divorced child". I asked him if he would be interested in Al Ateen. He said he would let me know when he was ready for that step. I know that the alcoholic is selfish, but how can they not see what their behavior does to their families?
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Unread 09-22-2009, 02:03 PM   #23
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Until your son is ready for that step, you may wish to purchase a copy of the "One Day at a Time", Alateen text.It is just a daily observation book, and I have one for my daughter and she finds it helpful.I believe you can pick them up at Al anon. Anything that helps, ya know.
Your son's comment about becoming a child of divorce is gut wrenching to hear about, but in the world today it is very common. Sometimes I sit and think, How did the people of the world become so selfish? Why is everyone always putting themselves first no matter who they hurt? I get frustrated thinking about it.
Then- I think back to when I was the one being selfish.I remind myself that I was in pain, too lost in myself to see who I was hurting. It was only when I stopped pitying myself and took genuine responsibility for my actions that I began to lift the fog that was blinding me. I felt fortunate that I had one person in my life who taught me about compassion and being responsible because had I not, who knows where I would be right now. Sometimes we lack basic skills to be productive members of society, then you add addiction and you have a huge problem on your hands. The addiction is only a part of the problem, finding what set it off is sometimes helpful in getting the person to realize they need help.
I will keep you in my thoughts, keep posting!
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Unread 10-27-2009, 04:37 PM   #24
mo5495
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Gee, one month later and still no progress. I know I am not the only person who feels this way.

Now my 14 year old son is doubting his faith. He keeps asking me "What does Dad believe?" He doesn't feel comfortable going to his father about these issues. Sometimes I feel so inadequate as to how to handle these issues.

I feel like there is a big pink elephant in the house. No one wants to be the one to mention it. It's easier just to go on day in day out without mentioning what is bothering everyone. That way, at least, there are no fights. AH still thinks that by adding a 6 pack in the fridge once in a while, that no one will notice the other case that he drank.

Is there any way off this merry-go-round?

I have made another appointment with my counselor. Hopefully he will be able to give me some insight on what to say to my son. Son is not ready to go to counseling or AlAteen yet.

Would it be best to keep things the way they are or confront AH yet again, knowing there will not be any different results?

Sometimes things seem so hopeless...
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Unread 10-27-2009, 09:59 PM   #25
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Dear Mo,

I know it feels hopeless when dealing with your child, they are the innocents in all of this and it hurts and is confusing, but please do not give up HOPE! These are uncharted waters you are trying to navigate. If you want off the merry go round, make a plan with your counselor and follow through with it. I know easier said than done, but think it through, are you really willing to go on like this indefinitely ?

When you say his Faith, are you referring to his beliefs, religion ? Is he doubting something exists when before he was raised with that belief ? Teenagers often have this struggle, especially if they were raised in a particular religion/belief. Or referring to Faith in his Dad ?
My husb was raised strict Catholic and around age 13- he rebelled and doubted everything, much to his devout Mother's fright. He was most upset that his Mother could not take communion or re-marry in her church because his Dad left her, this was not her decision but yet she was being punished. He found it hypocritical because she is a good person. Anyway, sorry to ramble on about that.

You are wise to seek professional advice on what your son is experiencing. I imagine he has a lot of bottled of emotions, imo- until you speak with someone - let him know you are there for him, you do not have to have all of the answers, you could explain the disease concept, that alcoholism is a disease, maybe that would comfort him ? Kids know a lot, example... this week is Red Ribbon Week at school and my first grader is learning all about drugs and alcohol. I really think just listening to him can help, he needs to know he can trust and count on someone. Then perhaps when he is ready he will talk to a counselor.

Until you can meet with your counselor, hang in there, we are here for you,
Take care, Carly
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Unread 10-29-2009, 05:13 PM   #26
Magda
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mo-

You know,one day things are going to blow.Too often in these situations, families do go on pretending nothing is that bad, and then one day- it all unfolds into a big heap of emotions.Just be cautious of that!
I remember when I was your son's age and my father drank every single day.He tried to conceal it, but I knew everything.My mother also tried very hard to pretend things were not as bad as they really were, but the reality of the disease fools no one. I wished my mom would have told him to leave.He ruined our family, and I hated him for it. Every embarrassing moment is ingrained in my memory and I think if only someone would have stood up for me, for my best interests.
As a parent myself, I swore I would never let my daughter go through that hell, and I kept my promise.She is 15 now, and my husband does not drink, but her Dad does.We never married because of other reasons, reasons in which his alcoholism played a huge part though.
I know it is difficult to be strong, but hopefully the counselor will aid you in confronting the truth.You and your son deserve far better than your present situation. You said your son is not ready to go to alateen or counseling yet, is it because he said so? Or is it because you feel he is not ready? Your son should have basic skills or education with alcoholism, that way he is better equipped to understand his father's problem.It is just my opinion, but it comes from my own experiences. Wishing you strength and a voice. Please keep posting!
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Unread 10-30-2009, 05:07 PM   #27
mo5495
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Thank you for pointing some things out to me. I think deep down, I know what I need to do.

My son has said he's not ready to talk to anyone about what's going on. How much of that, I wonder, is that he sees his father and I not talking about the important issues?

Looks like it's time for action...
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Unread 10-30-2009, 10:46 PM   #28
R. Lee
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Good luck on your decision mo.
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Unread 11-01-2009, 08:20 PM   #29
Magda
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mo-
There is a part of me that wishes I did not feel the need to tell people suffering from this disease in blunt terms that they need to realize things need to change.I want people to do it on their own, but it is hard to see the truth sometimes, because I think a part of us wants so badly for it all to just go away on it's own. Sadly, the alcoholic in our life rarely wakes up one day and decides they need to change or is able to stick with a plan.The mental defect has taken our loved one hostage, and alcohol becomes their only ally.
My thoughts are with you, as I surely realize you are going through a great deal.Just know that every emotion you feel is warranted and understood by most of us here.This is very hard for anyone to go through and it is not fair, but you have to believe that if you truly accept it and work towards mending the parts you are able to, you will be better off! Stay Strong!
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Unread 11-02-2009, 03:46 PM   #30
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I agree with Magda in the point she makes about the role of bringing to light the painful things about the addicted relationship. It is in the pointing these factors, behaviors and belief systems the I find myself empathizing (in a way) with some of the pain. As much as we would like to share hope, which happens, often things may become more difficult before they get better. If ever.
Still we abide by that which seems effective in helping the addict and those affected.

As I have said before, I have seem "miracles". Unforseen, serendipitous, flashes of inspiriation! Nothing magical, and still the struggle persists, but it is like there is a bump up in awareness.
You never know. All I have learned is just be ready to be receptive to those moments.
And how receptivity and faith lead to a healthier life over all.
All the best.
Jerry
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Unread 11-23-2009, 03:27 PM   #31
mo5495
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Well, I guess it's time to piss or get off the pot. I took my 14 year old to a tournament out of town Friday and Saturday, which left my husband home with our 10 year old. I knew when I spoke to him late Friday night that he was tipsy, if not drunk. When we arrived home at 2 am on Sat night, or Sunday morning, I guess, he seemed like he had had quite a bit to drink. This morning, taking my 10 year old to school, I asked him what they did Friday and Saturday. He said he played video games while Dad kept "falling asleep." Well, of course, the first thing my twisted mind does when I got back home was to start looking. I knew he had had 10 beers out of a 30 pack (my bad, I just "happened" to notice when I got home Saturday. Well, low and behold, I also found 3 empty six pack rings. I know I shouldn't be looking but Darn!!! I want to scream at him and scream at his mother and anyone else within ear shot. I know that won't solve anything though. Time for some honest talk when he gets home. No accusations, just want him to tell me how he wants to live his life.
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