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Unread 02-26-2013, 10:22 AM   #301
Tryntryagain
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Hello everyone.

R Lee, i want to share something with you. Everyone that has chosen to stand by me on this forum, encouraged me, supported me, are to me shining stars on a very dark night. However i find your words, and Saints words have so much resonation with me. I have to be honest and say that for a long while now i have taken in your words, and "spat them out", because they did not "suit my tastes". I want you to forgive me for doing so. In my defence i now know why, it was eloquent denial. I am in a place now where i can accept that, and hopefully find the strength to walk a differrent path. It bothers me that all your words have not been listened to by me. I do not want the responsibility for that to be attributed to my alcohol use, i want to take responsibility and apologise, but why was i not listening?......because of alcohol.

I hear you R Lee now, loud and clear.

I too was brought up a Catholic. An Italian Father and a Scottish Mother. I went to a Catholic Boarding school. What happened there, for me, was so horrific, that i ran away. I have never seen my Mother, Father or my brothers and sisters ever again. I was 11. The mess i have made of my life stems from there. Consequently any hint of religion and i am off.

So it has been. Religion, God, frightens me. It meant at some stage, someone was going to hurt me.

A dear friend tried to suggest to me that "God was God" and that the people involved in communicating that to me were wrong, but that does not mean God does not exist. I have struggled with that ever since. I was a choir boy for goodness sake, and at the age of only 9 was grade 8 on the piano. The reason that was unusual was because it was surprising that my fingers/hands could stretch an octave. I could play the violin, the cello. I played "stranger on the shore" on a clarinet when i was 7 to the whole school. All the time my music tutor was abusing me and the reason that i played so passionately was because i was trying to "tell everybody" what was happening.

The point being that is there is simply no way i could have been able to play all those instruments at such a young age because i had "learnt it". It was/is a gift.

R Lee?, Where did that gift come from?

So me and God have some serious talking to do. It came to me today, after reading your post, about going to meetings etc, and "taking what i need at this time", i thought of doing the same thing with God. I thought i would just "go" and sit in Church, and as much as i know this sounds odd, just listen to the sounds of the house of God and see how i feel? I am going to do both.

It's my birthday on Saturday. I am a fish! I am also 47. I can remember little of it. I plan to remember becoming 47.

Thank you R Lee.

Be peaceful, be healthy and be strong. Loveness to all
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Unread 02-26-2013, 12:39 PM   #302
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Tryn, AA is not a religious program. We don't have to go to church. A lot of AA's are Christian. Most use the name God.
I can't explain my higher power. I just know there is one.
I humble myself every night giving thanks that I made it through another day being sober. In the morning I ask for guidance in living a sober man for that day.
I do not blame God for anything.
I respect everones choice in their belief in God or a higher power.
Tryn you are on the road to recovery by getting out of the way & letting it happen. We have to work at staying sober. Build a tool box so you can go & use it rather than picking up the 1st drink.
I can only imagine what happened at that boarding school.
A hug for you. Let this just happen. You don't have to pick up a drink today.
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Unread 02-26-2013, 01:39 PM   #303
Tryntryagain
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Thank you so much R Lee. So much.

Loveness to you.
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Unread 02-26-2013, 02:40 PM   #304
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Tryn,
I am so sorry you didn't have family around while growing up, the abuse is the most horrible of all. No child should have to endure that. I can see why you have lost your faith in a just and loving God. Know that there is something out there greater than us. It has taught me humility and that the
World does not revolve around me. People act badly, commit wrongs but that is on them, they own it, or the should try to. There is no explanation why bad things happen to good people. It is up to us to rise above it and make the most of our lives regardless of the obstacles in our path. you are facing your demons head on. It is painful and difficult but will be your path to a peaceful life. I believe that with all my heart. I hope you can find the peace of mind you so deserve.....if not by yourself then with the
Help of those skilled in these sort of things. Stay safe my friend. And thank you for sharing a little more of your life with us.

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Unread 02-26-2013, 07:28 PM   #305
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Tryn, I agree with Saint about growing up without ever seeing your mother,father brothers& sisters since the age of 11 after what happened to you at the boardsing school.
We can not be a secret. We have to talk about the darkest parts of our lives. Things that have been done to us & things we have done.
It is very important who we choose to tell certain things. I will share things with a sponcer that I would never share at a meeting.
You are growing with what you have shared here. Continue to grow working on staying sober just for today.
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Unread 02-27-2013, 12:51 PM   #306
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Hello all. Thank you Saint, and thank you R Lee.

I am terribly low. It is funny that one can be aware on a "lifelong" basis of what has happened to them. But actually sharing it, saying it, never ceases to amaze me the very real effect it can still have. I wish i had not said it.

I am in a place that has doubly upset me today. I was talking to a friend who means the world to me. They have no understanding of addiction, even though they accpet i am. I open up to this person and told them about this site. I told them my screen name and they decided to "come and have a look". They decided to become judge, jury, and executioner. "There but the grace of God go i" i would have thought would have been the order of the day.

None of it. I had a simple txt telling me after a decade, they want no more to do with me. Apparently on the grounds that i had "not told the truth". What they mean is that i had not "let on" the devastating effect of my drinking. I had told them of the car crash, and could not possibly hide that i am an alcoholic trying to stay alive. No i did not tell them about the "nonsense" only an alcoholic can manage to contrive. I am devasted. I am the alcoholic. It is my problem. I live on my own, and try as hard as i can not to let my alcoholism effect others lives. It just has. I was stupid enough to trust someone i thought would understand. I shall not be doing that again. I am furious but at the same time, quite beside myself.

You know what?, i give up. I simply can not take this madness anymore.

Be peaceful, be healthy and be strong. Loveness to all.
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Unread 02-27-2013, 01:59 PM   #307
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Tryn,
I'm sorry your friends reacted so harshly. Give them time to process what you told them, they may come around. It was probably quite a shock to them. If they are good friends they should want to help you, not judge you in your time of need.
I've told only close friends and immediate family of my drinking problem. I choose who I tell and don't tell. If people ask I tell them I don't drink anymore, I've paid my dues. They may talk but I frankly don't care. I am much better off without alcohol in my life.
Tryn you need to be around people that know what you are going through. As Lee says you can't be a stranger. Surround yourself with people that can support you in early recovery. Go to your meeting.....what do you have to loose? Only your life.....
I had many dark days Tryn early on. Keep your eye on the prize, stop feeling sorry for yourself and get on with it already. Your new future awaits you.

Stay safe,
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Unread 02-27-2013, 04:27 PM   #308
Tryntryagain
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Thank you Saint. You are so right. You have made me cry. I think that is a good thing at this time. Thank you so much.

Be peaceful, be healthy and be strong. Loveness to all.
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Unread 02-27-2013, 04:51 PM   #309
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.......And ....breeeaathhhheeee
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Unread 02-27-2013, 07:35 PM   #310
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Tryn, Only suggestions here. No judging. You are an alcoholic. None of us come in this world & want to be an alcoholic. When I took my 1st drink I did not want to drink like an alcoholic. I wanted to fit in.
I don't know what to say about your so called friends judging you.
Alcoholic's are not bad people. We just do bad things when we drink. I did not get in trouble everytime I drank. But everytime I got in trouble I had been drinking.
You can't give up if you want to live.
If you want to die then continue what you have been doing. At least I won't hear about it here. Unless the so called friends that snooped on this site will tell us.
I have 5 & 1/2 hours to make it to another day. My sobriety comes before anyone elses.
I give you the hug you deserved from these so called friends you trusted.
I will not turn my back on the alcoholic who wants help.
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Unread 02-28-2013, 12:56 AM   #311
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Tryn,

When I first got sober I eventually told my doctor of my drinking problem. My immediate family had been seeing him for a number of years. I always lied about my drinking to him over the years although I think he suspected. I always felt bad about lying to him. When I finally told him of my drinking I was ashamed of myself and feeling very badly. Fortunately for me he was very understanding, took me into his personal office and spoke with me. He looked upon me with kindness and compassion and offerred me suggestions. I felt terrible that day but after a short period of time I was relieved that I had told him. I felt a small burden had been lifted from my shoulders and I can still recall the compassion on his face as I spoke with him that day. I didn't have to tell him but I did and I am the better for it today.

Yesterday you told us all of the pain of your childhood that you carry with you to this day. My hope is you can 'see' the kindness and compassion on my face towards you. I do not think less of you because of your past or of your alcohol use. You are among 'family' here and you will find 'family' in the real world if you continue to search for it. Do not give up hope on yourself or others out there.

You've come so far Tryn. Your on the cusp of something good. Keep pushing your boundaries, pushing your comfort zone. It will feel uncomfortable at first but that is where you will make progress. The life you seek is out there waiting for you. Fight for it.

Stay safe my friend,
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Unread 02-28-2013, 08:40 AM   #312
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Hello again everyone. R Lee and Saint, both your posts have meant a huge amount to me. It is the day after, and i have "calmed down" somewhat, having felt so upset yesterday. Perhaps i was being arrogant in thinking that another would really care what i was going through, but i really thought that person cared. All the indications was that was so. It was not to be. It's ok. It is the loneliness of addiction. I have to move on.

I was, for a brief while even worried about writing on here again, "incase my words were read by the wrong person now", but you know what?.....Let them read, they might learn something of themselves. I have nothing to hide. I am an alcoholic that is surely struggling right now, but i want help, i want to get better, i want to learn to overcome. For me this is the place where i can do that. I can not afford to censor my words because i am "embarrassed", i am at this time what i am, i need your support and help, it IS working. Albeit a bit slower than i would like but i am sure that i will get there.

I have made a choice today, it is all rather bizzare to be honest. As you know i have a new flat, and the other day i got a knock on the door. It was a little gathering with a "welcome box" for me! In it was a jar of coffee, oooo, cups, a candle, some washing up liquid, sugar, some bleach all wrapped up in a beautifullly presented box, i mean how lovely was that? The fellow lives a few doors up in one of the houses and has been in situ since October last year and was welcoming all us newcomers. He is also the guvnor of the local church. Today i found his e mail address, i wrote thanking him for his kind gift, and told him of my desire to natter with God. I shall wait for his reply.

That act has enabled me to "move on" from yesterday believing that i am taking proactive and positive steps to appropriate change. That's the logic anyway. I can also say that so far today, i have not had a drink. It is coming up to mid afternoon, and i feel ok for now. At the end of the day, that is my aim, that is my objective, to be free of alcohol.

Thank you R Lee, Thank you Saint, thank you all.

Be peaceful, be healthy and be strong. Loveness to all.
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Unread 02-28-2013, 09:34 AM   #313
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Saint i want to say something about your last post. I need you to accpet that was really helpful to me. I am amazed how much this "band of brothers and sisters here" can be so honest with each other after hiding away for so long.

Your honesty touches me, it is because i can touch your truth. I know it, i live it.

Yes i can see the compassion in your face. Yes i can feel your warmth, experience and wisdom, and yes, the "drip drip" of total honesty and truth from others is seeping gently into my bones. You are all so right. You have all been there, and i urge the ones.....like me.....that are reading this and struggling.....your words and thoughts, your experiences now, are so important to us all. You are important, get involved, pen a few words, it helps. It is keeping me alive.

Saint?....your post enabled my heart to recognise that all my life i have carried this burden of childhood, and my actions have begun it's legacy. I became frightened and cowardly young, it has never really changed. Until now. This moment in time. The last....well since i found you all, it is changing from deep within. Saint your post made me emotionally evaluate, that if one is frightened, runs away to seek the shadows inwhich to hide, they will only ever find darkness. So it has been.

If i could wish for one thing right now, it would be for courage. It is hard to wish for it, because i do not know what it is.

Loveness and thanks to you Saint.

Be peaceful, be healthy and be strong. Loveness to all
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Unread 02-28-2013, 03:50 PM   #314
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Tryn,

I would suggest you talk with someone skilled to help you sort out the feelings you have towards your past. They can get you on the path to resolving those issues and help you to deal with the pain and trauma of your childhood. Addicts die every day because they know they need help but do not reach out and get it. Reach out..... some things are just bigger than us.

Stay safe,
Saint
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Unread 02-28-2013, 07:35 PM   #315
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Tryn, Thank you for your kind words. As I have told others you help me stay sober.
It is good to hear that you have not drank today.
The fact that you want to change is so important. Yes you have fallen down so many times but you get up & tell the truth about drinking again. How could anyone find fault with you. The simple answer was you had more drinking to do. That is a dangerous fact. I hope you have hit your bottom & have made it to your turning point that being you can't drink.
I wish this could be the only place you had to come to share your experiance, strenght & hope. The problem is that you can not reach out to us when you have that ugre to drink.
With a support group of others like you you can get phone numbers & meet other recovering poeple like you. You then have a safety net in which you can call or meet a recovering person & talk to them rather than just picking up that drink.
I tell recovering alcoholics that I work with don't call while you are drunk. Call me before you drink or wait until you have sobered up.
I can only carry the message. I can not carry the alcoholic.
Hugs to you buddy.
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Unread 03-01-2013, 12:58 PM   #316
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Hello everyone. Hello Saint and R Lee.

I am getting a bit self concious of writing so often, but as R Lee has pinpointed, as yet this is my only real place of support.

I would like to respond to both Saint and R Lee.

Saint, i have tried in the past to approach issues of the past. I want to make it absolutely clear that because of the work that i have done, and do, i am more than aware of others suffering, aware of the unfairness life can be for any of us, and it is simply not possible to get some way through life without our own traumas and shocks in life, mine are just the same. That being said, in the last 3 months or so i have been seeing a Psychotherapist once a week. There has been a break because of my drunken accident and the loss of my car, travel and timing became an issue. It has been resolved and i will be restarting on 8th March.

The first few sessions i made it abundantly clear that i would refuse to talk about my past/childhood etc because it no longer has any importance. Indeed not. The point i am here is to learn how to "move on from here" irrespective of the past. I said i was "more than over" what ever scars i had acrued in the past, and i was here to prevent me getting anymore scars.

I am a bear with very little brains, and it has taken me until the last month or so, to realise what a complete load of hogwash i had come out with in "therapy". I mean if i was not prepared to "open up" in a plce that was safe, about what i was angry and hurt about, what was the point of being there? In my defence, i neither feel "safe" nor "capable" of letting those things out. That seems to be the problem for me. I know what i want to share, but i just can't. I don't trust my reactions and i do not know whether i would be "strong enough" to handle it. In the past i have opened my heart in rehab, and it all comes pouring out. The hours afterwards are like being on a bad trip. For at least a day or 2 i would just wander around in a "daze". Refusing to eat or talk to anyone. Even the threat of being asked to leave because i was not engaging had me silently going to pack my bag. In worry, they called in a "specialist" to see me. A forensic psychiatrist. I spent 1 session with them and it would suggested that i had "long term" treatment Re the issues that are mine. It was put in place, but the tiny little journey of "opening up" that from start to finished lasted no more than 3 weeks, had me seriously suicidal. So the concept of "re-engaging" was absolutely out of the question. Put simply, when i "open up" i quite, quite fall apart.

I went on to think, i would just have to keep it that way, and that, i now know, is why i am finding any dry time insiduously difficult. It is no longer an excuse, it really is the way it is.

Solution.

Engaging with this therapist, somehow. That leads into what R Lee has been saying to me for a very long time now, you all have to be fair, but R Lee is utterly adamant about it, and i make you right R Lee, i need that phone support, group support, but i have a terrible hang up. Instictively, i can not bare being "helped". To me it is humiliating and massively embarrasing. I don't like people touching me, hugging me, standing to close to me, all that kind of stuff. And more importantly those things i do not like effect me more on the inside. I don't like people getting to "know me". I am like a weather forecast....i have a lot of "fronts". Each one of them is lovable, full of energy, and has nothing but compassion. Behind it all is a very confused and frightened little boy quite frankly. 47 tomorrow........man up eh?

Have i the energy for the rooms? Hmmm.....can i afford not to have?

So that's my lot as i see things. I am going to give myself a birthday pressie tomorrow, infact 2. I i will take the day as pure as it comes. Feel grateful i am alive. I will stay sober for just a day at a time. I shall also make sure i put some food infront of me, even just to know what it looks like!

Finally thank you R Lee, and thank you Saint for the tremndous support you have been to me in the last few days especially. It's not so much that "it means the world to me", it is enabling me to find a way of living in this one.

Be peaceful, be healthy and be strong. Loveness to all.
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Unread 03-01-2013, 03:14 PM   #317
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Tryn, We are a lot alike. I don't like to be hugged or be in a closed room with a lot of people.
I have the suspicion your were molested as youngster. If I'm wrong please forgive me.
While I was in the Marine Corps I was on Christmas leave just before being deployed to Vietnam. I was 20 years old.
On my return to Camp Pendleton, CA from Dertoit, MI I had a change of planes in Chicago. I then flew on to L. A. CA. I was at the airport waiting for a cab to drive me to a bus station. A guy approached me & said he saw me depart from a plane from Chicago. He asked if I had seen any sailors on my flight who were in uniform as I was. I said no. He then said his brother must have missed his flight. (no cell phones in 1965) He offered me a ride to the bus station. He looked normal to me so I accepted. On the way he asked when I had to report back. I said I always left an extra travel day in the event ther was a delay. Long story short he convinced me to come back to his place & he would get me to the bus station the next day. We had a few drinks. I suspect he put something in one of my drinks becacuse the next thing I vaguely remember is baing raped in his front room.
I had no idea where I was & felt in danger the next day & my luggage was in the trunk of his car. I even let him drive me to the bus station. Once getting out of his car & getting my luggage from the trunk of his car. I felt safe to accuse him of what he did. he denied the rape & said I wanted to have sex with him & then he drove off.
I was 20 years old & a big bad Marine & blamed myself for putting myself in a situation of being molested. I was also angry with myself for not confronting him, calling the police ect. I even questioned my sexuality! I kept this secret for a long time. When I spoke about it was when my children were in their 30's. My daughter had reveled to my wife & I that a step father had molested her from the age of 9 to 11. I told her about my molestation to assure her it was not her fault.
I have now shared this with my sponcers in AA. I have been able to let it go.
I can not be a secret if I want to be sober. I
i'm very sure of the sponcers I have share this story with.
I had to share it with a sponcer because a openly gay recovering alcoholic with mental problems accused me of being homaphobic in a room of AA people because I refused to hug him. I had shook his hand & did not resond to his overbearing nature & insult.
I only reveal this becauseyou are not alone. We are here for you.

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Unread 03-01-2013, 04:18 PM   #318
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Tryn,

When I was a young man of 11, 12 years old the local physician as part of my 'yearly physical' brought me to orgasm as I laid on his examining table. His actions were not overtly sexual but certainly not part of what would constitute a 'normal' exam. I was embarrassed, humiliated and unsure of myself and to make it worse the Dr. suggested it was my 'problem'. I never told anyone. Apparently this Dr. had abused several other young men, years later he was brought up on charges. I was contacted by attorney's, brought into their office and questioned. I never helped them. I didn't want to get involved, didn't want my name to be published in the paper as this case went to trial. I was still humiliated and embarrassed as a 20 something young man even though I knew the responsibility lay with him. I've never told anyone 'till this day. Hadn't even thought about in years until Lee told his story although I'm sure it's always been working in the back of my mind....

Tryn I am happy you are seeing a psychiatrist and I hope you can find a way to put your trust in him. Trust is one of those things so easily broken and so very hard to regain. For me it takes time... Know that just as there are people that commit horrible acts there are people that are willing to help and have the compassion and empathy to understand what you have gone through and are going through. But it all comes down to trust, finding the right people to open up to. And it takes time..... to process the feelings and emotions but you need to do it sober.

It has taken me a long time because I am like you in many ways, I don't like to accept help from others but I have come to find and accept that I can't do it all. That it is OK to let other's help us on our journey through life. I too would much rather help other's than accept that same help in return. Addiction is an isolating disease. We hide behind our drug of choice, and while we hide we do not grow. I am reminded at times of the saying "If not for the cracks how would the light get in". Tryn, you're doing the right things, it's painful but keep pushing ahead. It is so worth it. And yes, we are all here for you. Thanks for sharing.

Stay safe my friend,
Saint
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Unread 03-01-2013, 04:23 PM   #319
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R Lee, that is a deeply personal and deeply disturbing journey you have shared. Within it contains many lessons i can learn from. It is why i am humbled that you have shared it with me, your horrifying experience is not wasted on me.

My journey you know up until running away at 11, and that was it. The next 7/8 years were/are not something that words can address. When abuse is not refined to instances, but as a teen you subscribe to it for survival, and seek out "easy survival" which pays the wages of the most selfish kinds of abuse, my search for identity was never going to be terribly positive.

But it is now. I really can feel strength inside. I know were it comes from, and that's me. I just need to stand aside and let me out. What is there to lose?

R Lee, if my words could hug, if my compassion could fly, if my wish for well being for you could be transported, they would all arrive at your door at the same time. I value so much what you have shared.

Loveness to you R Lee.

Be peaceful, be healthy and be strong. Loveness to all.
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Unread 03-01-2013, 04:31 PM   #320
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Saint your post happened at exactly the same time!

Never does it cease to amaze me how any of us get by. Saint, thank you so much for opening up in supporting me. I am trying to do the right things in that i am concious what would be a beneficial path for me, but it is one thing........

I just want to be "fixed". I don't want to bother anyone, or get in anyones way, i just want to walk peacefully by and help who i can on the way. It never seems to happen that way. There are many reasons why, and i concede unless i can get dry time, i will never know what any of them really are.

Loveness to you Saint.

Be peaceful, be healthy and be strong. Loveness to all.
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Unread 03-01-2013, 10:32 PM   #321
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Tryn, I don't know that we can be fixed.
The way I stay sober is to work my program to the best of my ability 1 day at a time.
I don't mess with my program. If it take me to reveal that terrible time in my life to help another alcoholic I will share it.
I hope that you can continue on in your quest for sobriety.
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Unread 03-01-2013, 10:36 PM   #322
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Saint, Thanks for sharing your experience. That showed guts to not leave me alone with my story.
You help me stay sober!
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Unread 03-02-2013, 06:58 AM   #323
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Hello all, hello Saint and R Lee.

After spending a great deal of time reading your last posts over and over again, feeling so humbled i wish to share mine with you.

I was born into a very wealthy family. I very rarely saw my parents. I was brought up in a mansion in the countryside, and the staff and the children had a "wing" to the house, hence seeing our parents very rare indeed. I was seen to by au pair girls, nannies, butlers, chaffeurs, gardeners and cooks. I was sent to boarding school at 6 and the abuse started almost immediately. I made it to 11, when one last beating broke me and i ran away.

I read in a book that "people ran away to London", and just before my 12th birthday i found myself in Leicester Square in Soho in London, terrified beyond words. My first night in the rain and the cold just wandering around. The lights, the sounds, the noise, the smells. Millions of people, i had never seen such sights before. It was the first time in my life i stole. I stole a baggette from outside a restaurant in the early hours, that was their delivery for the day. I only took one. Somehow that simple act made me recognise, "i was on my own".

Unbeknown to me there was a "street culture". There were lots of kids on the streets, they all new one another and slept on the roofs in Charing Cross Road. (Heat rises, the roofs were warm) It did not take long for them to recognise that there was a "new kid on the block" and before long i ws "running with them". I got close to a young chap who recognising that i was "well out of my depth" told me to "make up a past" as if it was known where i came from i would be "dead meat". It is a long story as to how i managed this, suffice to say i even changed my accent. By the time i was 13 i was working as a rent boy. It was so difficult for me becuase i was not gay so sexual activity was so incredibly damaging to me. I ended up "specialising" as my pimp realised that i wasn't much kop as a rent boy, so i was used in S/M activities, and life went from revulsion to pain. It would take me so long to explain to you what went on over those years but by the time i was 18, i was using every drug known to man, injecting several times a day. I was drinking beyond belief, and after years on the street i was now quite a "feature". An angry young fellow that was most certainly learning the hard way. The men that i "entertained" where not what you would think. It was the late70's early 80,s, and my clientelle woud include prominent people, i even serviced a man regulaly in a flat in Baker Street, he had been the headmaster of a prominent and famous public school for nearly 30 years, i could go on, but you get my drift.

It was not possible to live the life i was without getting into trouble. By the time i was 19 i was on probation and had several minor convictions. I was also involved in the gang culture and was witnessing some of the most horrific violence i have ever seen. Having run to London as a child i went on to run away from it as a young man. I would just like to add that in the course of those years i created "the advisory service for squatters" and i was attributed of housing 100's of street people whilst still a child myself. Years i spent on those wretched streets. By now i had a girlfriend who knew of a friend who had a caravan in the countryside near the sea. By now, totally out of control, addicted to everything, with a body that had been raped, beaten, stabbed and left for dead, it took but a matter of hours in solitude and peace to fall apart. I was arrested and given a new probation order and a new probation officer. I ended up marrying her.

Of course i was a raging alcoholic and a drug addict and of course it didn't last. My drinking was totally out of control. I went for months at a time without any recollection of anything. To this day, Re my marriage, i have no idea what really happened. I can't remember.

Years rolled on with me creating opportunities and then drinking my way out of them. My dear Friends, that has never changed. I have got a long way with some of those opportunites. I have given speeches up and down the land about the "way out of a life like mine". I have been interveiwed on television and on radio. Like R Lee i have set up groups within prisons both womens and mens. I have developed services for people who have my struggles and issues and have written many published articles on the subject, but all the time i have never, honestly, really come close to "getting on top of things" myself. I have kept the whole shebang hidden, getting people to believe i had "got through it all" because i was such a strong and capable person.

The truth is that i have never come to terms with what has gone on for me, i have never been strong or capable, and that is what has hurt me most of all.

I came to realise when i had to "resign from everything" before i made an utter fool out of myself before all, that my coping mechanisms where not only as useful as a paper bag in the rain, they were also becoming life threatening. In terms of supporting others and "guiding people", i had to concede that i couldn't guide a seagul to the coast, it is then i found this forum.

Today will be a hapy day. It is my birthday, am i 47 and i shall be going for a walk in the park this afternoon with 1 of my daughters and grandchildren. I adore them, and they me. They know all about me, they know of my struggles and they care for me beyond belief. They do not and will not enable, but i have never put them in a position when that was an issue. We shall meander through the park, laugh with the little'un and breathe in the air of life. But i know deep inside, when i break of the end of a baggette to hand to my grand child to feed the ducks, the first baggette i stole will flood my mind, my heart cracks, and i stumble and fall.

No more, no more, no more. I am stronger than this. I will make sure that Tryn will take himself to bed tonight at the end of a dry and beautiful day spent with my beautiful children. I am so glad to be alive.

Be peaceful, be healthy and be strong. Loveness to all.
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Unread 03-02-2013, 02:09 PM   #324
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Tryn, You grew up on the streets of London by yourself. You did what you had to do to survive.
Go by the shop where you stole the baggette & pay for it. If it is not there buy a baggette & give it to a homeless person.
The baggette should not bother you any longer unless you want to hang on to somethig done so long ago & play mind games with it to keep youself down.
Thanks for your story. I'm glad you survived to the age of 47 & you have children & grandchildren in your life.
Please continue to try each new day to stay sober. Stay in contact no matter what you chose to do.
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Unread 03-02-2013, 03:19 PM   #325
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Tryn,

Ohhhh but I do see someone strong and capable.

You spoke earlier of wanting to be 'fixed'. I believe we can be 'fixed', ie come to accept our past, forgive ourselves, love ourselves for who we are today and find peace of mind and body. If we think we can't be 'fixed', we are right.

Enjoy your day with your family. Thank you for sharing your story and your words with us.

Regards,
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Unread 03-02-2013, 03:22 PM   #326
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Hello all. A beautiful day. No less.

R Lee, the "steps" are all well and good, and "buying a baggette for a homeless person", and pay for the baggette that i stole, was to miss the point of all i was trying to share.

I not only bought the metaphorical baggette, i enable places that they were made. Atoning "for my sins" is not what my future is about. I have "paid" time over time, hand over fist, to pay for that baggette. I achieved that a long time ago.

The baggette bothers me because it represents a time of my life where "the wheels came off". A simple "step", is not enough for me to repair things. Building the desire to aspire has never been a problem, but "keeping it simple" is not something i recognise. It is not simple R Lee, at least not to me. I know that working your program works for you, i know you feel it would work for many, but not for all, and i know that you feel those that do not work the program are likely to meet an untimely end. I suppose all i can say is some that struggle so much with the big book, do not neccesarily disagree with it, it just means to them, they find little within they recognise, can relate to, or see themselves relating to in the future. I am such.

I am not dismissing your guidance, i am grateful for it, but at this time, the idea that i would "pay back" to repair my morals, is simply not what is required. I feel understanding myself is what is required, being subservient about myself is something i struggle with and put simply, the reason why i have struggled in the first place.

I have raised my desire to natter with God, to find an understanding of what that might mean. I am looking forward to engaging with that part of myself. But "make amends" R Lee? Long since done. In my personal opinion i think "make amends" is actually supposed to mean "let go", perhaps not withstanding the people it might involve, no R Lee, "make amends" designed to engender remorse, is not nessecary for me.

I am struggling for sure, but i still steer my ship. Every word, every experience helps me do so. As yet i am unable, with a respectful amount of knowledge of 12 step program, to take it with more than a pinch of salt.

Be peaceful, be healthy and be strong. Loveness to all.
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Unread 03-02-2013, 10:25 PM   #327
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Tryn, There are many ways to get sober. That may suprise you that my way is not the only way to get sober.

You don't know how I feel about other's chances of sobriety beside's the one I have chosen.

I have forgiven myself with the support of others in my program.

Sometimes poeple are too smart for their own good & assume what others feel.

My program is simple to read as long as you don't have to read the big Book alone. Yes it is simple to read but it takes hard work to not drink & and avoid being a dry drunk. Today I have a thinking problem more than a drinking problem. My thinking can take me places where it is very dangerous.

The Big Book was written back in 1939 & is very hard to read as it uses words & phrases that are not used much anymore. It was suggested that I buy & read the Big Book. I bought one but did not like reading it. I was putting myself in the drivers seat. Being in the drivers seat is very dangerous for the alcoholic.

I go to a Big Book study group every Thursday & we read a coulple of paragraphs then there are questions & we have an open forum to discuss what we have read & how it pertains to our experiance, strength & hope. This way I can get through it. I have been going to the big Book study group for 8 years & always learn something I haven't picked up before.

Tryn, Thanks for your above responce. You help me stay sober for just today.

I wish you the best friend.

Last edited by R. Lee; 03-02-2013 at 10:39 PM..
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Unread 03-03-2013, 05:05 AM   #328
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Try'n
Yes you may still be steering your ship but do you know where you are going??.

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Unread 03-03-2013, 09:44 AM   #329
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R Lee i apologise if i sounded angry and directed that at you. It was not meant to sound or be that way. trying to share my little lot took it out of me a bit more than i reckoned yesterday. I was "damning" my weaknesses and inabilities, it came out wrong, it was late, and i had just past "the point of no return", in that i was sober and the off licence was now shut. As soon as it did, i went "all funny". I suddenly "wanted a drink" and was berating myself for A) depriving myself of one, B) being angry i was thinking that way and C) why i couldn't "get it".

I came online to write, i read your wonderfully supportive post.......and threw it back at you.

I apologise R Lee. Loveness to you.

Be peaceful, be healthy and be strong. Loveness to all.
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Unread 03-03-2013, 09:49 AM   #330
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Hello everyone.

No Saint, i don't. I know where i want to go, i am so sure i have got the "engine to get me there", but you know i'm just going round in circles, and that at each pass, the engine is not so strong.

All i have at the min is that. I know what i have to do. Easy innit? (joke!)

Loveness to you Saint.

Be peaceful, be healthy and be strong. Loveness to all.
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Unread 03-03-2013, 11:47 AM   #331
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Dear Tryn,
I am sorry your trusted friend did not give you the support or understanding when you shared your experience. I had a dear friend and once I told her my story including the depths that my addiction took me to she was so disgusted, let me know just how disgusted , threw in some brutal insults and I've not heard from her since. I was gobsmacked as never in a million years would I think she would react this way. It hurt but I had supportive friends around me who helped me understand not everyone will react the way I might hope.

Regarding incidents that happened to us as children, adolescents etc.. I did not tell anyone until I was in my 20s. All the while thinking it was my fault, burning with shame I just wanted to forget it ever happened.
I have been to countless therapists, "rehabs" and dealing with childhood issues was something I , denied or tried to avoid. It wasn't until I learned how damaging feelings of Shame can be and how they follow us into adulthood, impact relationships, decisions, perceptions..... even then I tried to minimize what happened. I underestimated the unresolved feelings and finally made peace with it. It was very freeing not to carry the shame and guilt.

Tryn,
I Know I am out of the loop but this thread struck a chord with me. To anyone with unresolved issues from the past imo better to seek help, face it, recover from it - shame is such a damaging emotion- imo.
Hang in there and take care, Carly
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Unread 03-03-2013, 01:05 PM   #332
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Tryn, I fully understand & support you.
My best to you. Think that 1st drink through.
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Unread 03-03-2013, 05:00 PM   #333
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Tryn,

You are never far from my thoughts these days. There's a joke where the drunk is told he will not find his answers at the bottom of the bottle. The drunk replies "I know that. That's why I'm going to get another".

For me it's not being strong enough to not drink, it was being strong enough to let myself accept the fact that I can't drink. With acceptance came forgiveness, freedom from the shame, from the guilt of all the hiding from myself and others. Such as it is with most things in life I would gather. By not drinking, i.e, not running from myself I am able to work on myself, become a better person, such as I am, with all my faults. I can now deal with life on life's terms, for better or worse.

I recall reading a story where the Pope that was shot met with the person. Not to call him a sinner, but to forgive him for his actions. They prayed together. Tryn the path to healing is letting go of the anger, the shame, the guilt. The path to healing is forgiveness. With forgiveness comes peace of mind and body. Let other's help you help yourself. Your are so worth it. I wish you the peace you so truly deserve.

Stay safe my friend. We are all here for you. Think through that first drink.(((HUGGGSS)))

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Unread 03-04-2013, 06:04 AM   #334
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Hello everyone. Thank you Carly, R Lee, and Saint your last post has, at last, pushed me into action. I know that hug was heartfelt. It has been growing as the honesty that i am so grateful to share has reflected back at me. My finger is most definately pointing at me now. I can hide from it, ignore it no longer.

I have sought out a meeting for 6.30pm tonight. I know where it is, i know how to get there and i am physically capable of doing so. My first thought was overwhelming anxiety, as at first it felt i was "going backwards". I don't believe it is, in that the man that will join and listen to my fellow alcoholics tonight, is not the same man that was in the rooms in the past.

Saint, Carly and R Lee, you are so right, i have to reach out. I need help. My angry post to R Lee, just a tiny example of my "muddled upness", i seek clarity, hope and sobriety.

I expect nothing other than to share the company of others that know the power of a disease that is killing me. They will know it is killing me, i need that, instead of brushing everything aside believing that somehow i am different from everybody else, and i will sort it my way. I am not different, i can not cope with this on my own. I am on my way to seek out the support i desperately need.

Thank you everyone, especially R Lee and Saint, i am hoping i am now on my way to a better journey, more understanding and a bit of compassion for myself. It won't make sobriety "easy", but it might make it achievable.

Be peaceful, be healthy and be strong. Loveness to all.
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Unread 03-04-2013, 07:25 AM   #335
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Tryn,

I am proud of you. I am proud of you for taking a chance on yourself, going out of your comfort zone, for trying something different. Tryn you have come so far these past months. Yes it has been rocky at times for you, but with honesty to self comes growth. For better or worse please tell us how your meeting goes. I'll be sending positive thoughts your way.

Peace,
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Unread 03-04-2013, 10:34 AM   #336
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Tryn, Great news. Take what you need from that meeting. We seek progress not perfection. Admiting that we are powerless over alcohol & our lives have become unmanageable is the only step that we have to work 100%.
Recovering alcoholics should make you feel welcome & the most important person in the room.

Good luck & Hugs!!
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Unread 03-04-2013, 12:05 PM   #337
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Thank you Saint, thank you R Lee.

It is bang on 5pm. Meeting at 6.30pm. I am bathed, clean, shaky and sober. It has been an extremely long day, i have had not much else on my mind. I am now committed to go.

If there is someone out there that can grant me 1 thing, can a have a little bit of courage please?

Will let you know.

Be peaceful, be healthy and be strong. Here goes. Loveness to all.
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Unread 03-04-2013, 01:30 PM   #338
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Tryn,
We'll be right there with you.

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Unread 03-04-2013, 01:53 PM   #339
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Tryn -

You are in my prayers. Make the meeting, take from it what you need. We are all in this together. Jenm
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Unread 03-04-2013, 03:33 PM   #340
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Tryn, We will be there with you. Just be willing to listen.
Wait & see who you want to share your secrets with. Get phone numbers & call them before you take a drink.
None of us wanted to be an alcoholic when we 1st drank.
You are a good man who is sick with the disease alcoholism.
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Unread 03-04-2013, 04:21 PM   #341
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Whoa! Back. Jeeeezzee. I am feeling "family" at the mo, all of you feel family to me. I apologise if this turns out to be over the top, but i am in a strange place.

I am not sure how to describe to you this evenings events...(and breathe). I'll start from the top. I am so very glad i went along...ish. I have "shuggled" things around tomorrow and i am being given a lift to a lunchtime meeting.

I feel absolutely dreadful.

I have to pinch myself. Am i the same man that has spent all his life with addicts, and the last 10 years working to support them? Am i the same man that set up 2 AA groups, but declined to attend myself? What happened to the fellow that sat for years on cold winter nights holding Peer Support groups that nobody turned up at? 6 rehabs, countless detoxes, talking to Commissioners and directing them how to sepnd their money. I was a service development officer for goodness sake!

Where did he go?....Because he sure wasn't there tonight.

Does anyone have a clue what i am talking about? I have just "fallen apart". (I have not taken a sip of alcohol today)

The fellow i was talking about that acheived those things, walked into the meeting tonight thinking, oh my goodness, here we go, heard it all before"

You know how i waffle so i will keep this short, that fellow was not there...i was, and it hurts.....oh my God it hurts!!!!!!!!!

Ever felt naked? Jeeezzeee!!! I did not realise until i went tonight that i had grown up somewhat. I mean how do you "know" if you are growing up? By your actions, your behaviour or your wisdom? It's all 3 isn't it. It is isn't it? It hit me like a brick tonight. Boy did it. All that "i have done" Re the work with fellow sufferers means diddly squat actually. I am going to die. I am going to die because of me. Not because of anything that has happened, not because of "what i think", but because of me. That room focussed me, on me. I did not like it one little bit. Therein lies my problem, and my solution, right there.

I sit with Psychotherapists and feel decidely uncomfortable. You can imagine with my little lot i have had "professionals" queuing up over the years to have their shot. Never ever have i felt approaching comfortable. I have the most gloriously beautiful friends and children, but i feel uncomfortable being me, an alcoholic, around them. Tonight i felt more uncomfortable than i can remember, but hear this...i felt wildly uncomfortable, in a comfortable place. (Gosh i hope this is making sense. My mind is a whirl after tonight)

Meeting.

1st 5 mins......"here we go. Same old same old"
10 mins...."Hold on, what's happening here?"
15 mins.....Trying not to cry. Don't know why.
20 mins.....Can't handle this. I am getting angry. I am hurting and can't control it. I have to get out of here.
21 mins. ......Saint' R Lee, Carly, jenm, Frankie, Addiction Survivors
22 mins....not going to run away...not going to cry here. I am strong. Need to listen.
23-90 mins...fluctuating between emotional collapse, and feeling incredibly strong. All with a smile. I can not explain that bit. I did not speak. A fellow that can't keep his mouth shut in any situation, could find not a single word. I just wanted my mum.

I could not look people in the eye at the end. Had the door been shut i would have jumped out of the window for one reason, and one reason only, i wanted to get away from myself. I wanted to disassociate myself, with me. I just wanted to run.

I did not see the eyes, but i felt a hand that i had extended for a handshake, notlet my hand go. That is the fellow that is giving me a lift tomorrow lunchtime.

All of you, and for your unjudging and loving support, Saint, R Lee, i only recognised why he would not let my hand go, because you didn't. Thank you so very much.

I am relieved, very frightened, ...oh never mind, i'm terrified. If only i knew what of.

Tonight i am dry and my heart is sober and it hurts. If sobriety means knowing it hurts.....i'm in.

Sorry i have been long winded, but you know me by now, i always am.

Be peaceful, be healthy and be strong. A very special loveness and warmth to all.
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Unread 03-04-2013, 04:35 PM   #342
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PS.

It has been miserable weather of one sort or another here in England. Today it was like the Country had come out of the dark ages, and the sun spread across us. We have not seen the sun set, since last year. Tonight when i went to my meeting it was setting. The whole sky was dancing with deep emotional colours, and the sun was huge.

It was beautiful. Happy Spring everyone.

Be peaceful, be healthy and be strong. Loveness to all.
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Unread 03-04-2013, 05:32 PM   #343
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Tryn,

You move me to the brink of tears....

I recall laying on the floor of my old house, crying.... forgiving myself for being me, acknowledging who I am, an alcoholic. It hurt, still brings a lump to my throat now as I recall that day. I was emotionally wiped out. The pain will go away and when it does the healing will begin.

When I first met with my therapist I was also unsure, literally offbalance. I resolved to be honest and tell all such as I understood it. It brought me peace knowing I did not hold anything back.

I am happy for you Tryn. I am sooo happy for you. Welcome to our family!

Peace,
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Unread 03-04-2013, 10:34 PM   #344
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Good job Tryn!! We are pulling for you.
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Unread 03-05-2013, 02:22 PM   #345
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Hello all. I went to my lunchtime meeting. When i got there i realised that i was "exahausted" with me. Just listening. Hearing others. I realised how tired i was. I wished for their peace, their silence, the "comfort" that was in the room.

Will i ever find that?

I am so very tired.

Be peaceful, be healthy and be strong. Lovenes to all.
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Unread 03-05-2013, 05:37 PM   #346
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Tryn,

We didn't get sick in one day, it will take more than a day to get better but yes, there is a better life for you in sobriety. Yes you can have what they have.... keep you eye on the prize and work it. Hang in there,

Wishing you the best,
Saint

p.s Thought of you last night as I was running to the top of a hill. A gust of wind helped blew from behing and propelled me up and over the top. I imagined that gust of wind was you helping me out.... Thanks for the lift!
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Unread 03-05-2013, 09:21 PM   #347
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Tryn, It will get better.
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Unread 03-06-2013, 10:22 AM   #348
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Tryn,

Saw this quote and thought of you.

"We can let the circumstances of our lives harden us so that we become increasingly resentful and afraid, or we can let them soften us, and make us kinder. We always have that choice."

Dalai Lama


Hope your feeling a little better today,
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Unread 03-06-2013, 10:43 AM   #349
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Hello everyone, Saint, R Lee, thank you so much.

Gosh i am tired, and sober. I have corresponded with the friend that "knocked my socks off", and you were right. They needed time to take it in. That has allowed me relief in myself. It has been such a difficult time.

I told you i went to a meeting yesterday lunchtime. Again i was glad i went. I have to say that the dynamics were different, but the underlying desire for sobriety was the same. I am going over to my new flat for a couple of days, as hopefully by the end of the week it will be "livable in", you know telly, something to sit on! that kind of thing, so it may be a day or 2 before i post again. It is a new area, and i have already "found a meeting" in that i know there is one nearby, but as yet i have not been able to "find anything yet", the vicar fellow that i told you about has offered to show me where things are, and i shall go with that.

So i am not sure when will be my next meeting, but it will be soon, and you know i will let you know. I am finding not drinking, very, very hard indeed. (God i hate the stuff)

I can see a future. Truly i can. Free of alcohol. Independent at last.

Got to rush, got to get a bus,

Be peaceful, be healthy and be strong. Loveness to all. Saint, R Lee, mahousive hugs.
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Unread 03-06-2013, 02:22 PM   #350
R. Lee
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Tryn, You sound good. Think that 1st drink through.
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