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Unread 03-15-2016, 10:32 AM   #1
jolter
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Default Coming off subs

Hi, I was a member here around 4-5yrs ago and honestly could not remember my user name. New laptop, fried motherboard on old one, lost most info. Anyways I had been on subs twice before as I recall and jumped at around .25mg with not too much difficulty. Was on them for oxy abuse.
According to my surgeon I should be having my second knee replacement and the first one should have lasted into my early 30's. I'm 59. Got hit by car when I was 13 and tore up knee.
I took early retirement at 55 which I get a check every month but no insurance. This check covers health insurance every month along with Marketplace (Obama care) whatever they call it.
I work 2 jobs both under table so no insurance. Also taking care of elderly relative in poor health that practically raised my sister and I until I was around 14. No more relatives left to help out. I work 7 days a week and I where knee brace but the pain is getting intence to walk on.
I went to my PC DR. and he recommended pain clinic (Big Mistake) It worked for a few months but then my monthly script would be gone in a couple weeks. I went and told the pain Dr. if he could suggest something else. Anything, maybe weekly script. He blew up and told me to get out. I told him to go F himself.
At this time my relative had to get a defibulator so not good time for surgery. Seems like it never is.
Of course I get back into the oxys for several months very heavy.
I go back to sub DR. and he took me back and he starts me on 12mg day. I was taking anywheres from 300-400mg oxy/day. 12-14 30mg Roxys daily. He tried to start me on 8mg sub but it just didn,t cut it.
I told him I wanted to be off these by late Feb. 2016 or early March because I can,t go on without surgery. Its gotten to that point.
I was on 2mg strips in Feb. taking 1.5mg/day. I was cutting dose in half taking twice a day for better pain management. It was working ok.
Feb.15th last visit with Sub Dr. Itold him I want to be off this by end of March because I'd scheduled surgery for around first of April.
He prescribes 11 2 mg strips. Use half film every morning for 2 week then half film every morning thereafter. This puts me at .5mg if I skip a day when I jump? I'm not sure my math stinks.
1mg once a day just was not cutting it pain wise. But I did it for 2 weeks like I was suppose to. Tried skipping day and could hardly walk so I get on line and find this site that you can put in how many mgs. your on and its a 19 day taper requireing 9mgs total.
I give it a try. Thats allmost as much as I had left.
It goes 75mgs for 3 days.
0.50 for 4 days.
0.25mgs for 4 days.
0.13mgs for 3 days.
0.00mgs for 2 days.
Now get this, on the 19 day says to take 2.00mgs
They call this optional ending kicker dose object being to extend the halflife.
It said there has been no studies but Drs that have used this. The higher dose is suppose to raise bupe blood levels without raising tolerance as this final dose metabolizes blood levels slowly decrease until reaching zero. They say thats the theory anyways.
I did all this but took 0.50 Sunday because my leg was killing me.
Might have took an extra 0.25 up in the 0.50 doses.
Tommorow I,m suppose to go down to the 0.13mg.
They got to be kidding. This might work for getting off bupe but below 1.5mg split up so twice a day this does not work for my pain.
Let alone who would want to prolong a withdrawal with a 2.00mg dose? Beats me.
BTW this 19 day thing would end March 21.
Got call that surgeon had family emergency and have pushed my surgery back to April 13th.
This 0.25mg is not cutting the cake.
I have to work.
Surgeon wanted me to stop work 2 weeks before surgery and do these leg excercises. I told him I couldn,t afford to loose 2 weeks pay. He said thats up to you.
I probably have 150 10mg oxy laying around the house.
Now my sub Dr. is real nice and he said that you know they will give you opiates after surgery and if you have any problems whatsoever with them then give him a call and he will take me back for a fast taper.
Would it be a recipe for disaster if I started taking 1 10mg oxy every 8hrs until surgery?
I take my small sub dose at 3-4am because I have to get to work early.
It does help for 4-5 hrs.somewhat, as long as I'm not lifting to heavy stuff or have to walk too far. Both my jobs are manual labor and only reason I'm not at work right now is that I have to take relative to appointment in a little while.
I know I won,t get high off such small dose of oxy but will it help for pain until surgery?
I really don't want to call the sub DR. back and ask for a few more.
I am done with getting high and I am done with subs.
I just need to work until I get my knee fixed which may involve thigh. He said he won't know until he gets in there.
BTW insurance did not cover subs this time around and as you all know sub Dr. cash only.
I am so broke I can hardly put food on table. Another months wages will really help me get through down time after surgery.
Sorry so long but had to get this out. I have no one to really talk to and I sure could use someones opinion. Much thanks.

Last edited by jolter; 03-15-2016 at 10:38 AM.. Reason: meant to say 6 days at 0.50mg
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Unread 03-15-2016, 10:39 AM   #2
jolter
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I meant on the 19 day thing its 6days on 0.50mg. Somehow it adds up to 19 days.
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Unread 03-15-2016, 03:13 PM   #3
jolter
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Just got back from DRS appointment with relative and got on here to see if anyone replied REread my post another mistake. Feb15 last appointment with sub DR. got 11 2mg strips. Directions were half stip everyday for 2 weeks then half strip every other day. Like I said my math stinks but would this not be making the jump at 0.50mg?
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Unread 03-15-2016, 04:49 PM   #4
NancyB
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Hi jolter, you're correct, with the halflife of around 37 hours, that would be like jumping from .5mg. and you'd have nothing to help you with your pain at that point. I have heard of doing that 2mg last dose before and it has worked for some people. Like anything else, there's no cut and dry answer because everyone is so different.

You asked: "Would it be a recipe for disaster if I started taking 1 10mg oxy every 8hrs until surgery?" Only you can answer that question. Would you be able to stick with that or would you find yourself taking more and more? There are people here who were prescribed full agonists prior to surgery so that the bupe would be out of their systems. So it's not unheard of. If you had someone to hold the oxy so you weren't tempted to take more would be the best scenario. But it really comes down to how you feel you could handle it.

Hope that's somewhat helpful anyways.

Nancy
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Unread 03-16-2016, 04:51 AM   #5
jolter
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This is a test. I keep getting a 403 error or 703. This was yesterday. I tried on my cell phone while waiting in Drs office yesterday. Could not reply either but I could click a highlighted message that said click and inform administrator what was going on.
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Unread 03-16-2016, 06:45 AM   #6
jolter
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Hi Nancy, I got another 403 forbidden to reply again after The first test went through.
I wrote a reply to you message and forbidden 403 comes back.
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Unread 03-16-2016, 06:54 AM   #7
jolter
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Hi Nancy, After I tried my test that went through this morning I tried to write a reply to you question and I got another 403 Forbidden error message saying I do not have permission to access/bulletin reply php on this server. If this goes through I really don,t know whats up.
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Unread 03-16-2016, 07:05 AM   #8
NancyB
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Hi jolter, I got it yesterday morning, but that was it. I ended up posting a post in 3 segments. lol Angie said she got the message when she tried posting the medication that her dog takes.

I'll have it looked into, but in the meantime see if you can start a new thread with your response and I'll merge it. Or post small posts like you've done to see if that works. Others are posting without issue, so it seems to be a random thing.

Sorry about that. Now let's see if this goes through...

Nancy
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Unread 03-17-2016, 07:54 AM   #9
morphing
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It's the anti-spam software. You're using some word that is popular in spam messages, like maybe the full name or brand name of a drug. For example, there are lots of ads for vi@gr@. That's one way to get around it...it let me post it since I substituted the "@" for the "a".
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Unread 03-17-2016, 09:11 AM   #10
jolter
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Thanks for advice. I tried a new thread this morning and got the same Forbidden 403 message. And I did use full name of a couple meds that my uncle uses for heart condition. Will try again in morning. Gotta run.
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Unread 03-18-2016, 08:17 AM   #11
jolter
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Hi, Contacted sub dr and surgeon about swich I was talking about and they both gave ok. Both said same warning and suggested to do what Nancy said below. Sub Dr. said try three but thinks it would not work long enough. He suggested four like when in pain clinic. Work ended up being long hard day yesterday. IT worked sort of relief like one and half to two mg of S. Great, thats all I was looking for. I can do this for less then a month and counting. Hope this reply goes through. Thanks
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Unread 03-18-2016, 09:48 AM   #12
NancyB
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Hi jolter, glad you were able to talk with both of your doctors. Have you tried taking aleve also to see if that might help too? Quite a few people here over the years have said that helped for pain along with the bupe and for some, even after they tapered off. Just a thought.

Nancy
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Important disclaimer: Any information in this post is not and does not constitute medical advice under any circumstances. Addiction Survivors, Inc. does not warranty or guarantee the accurateness, completeness, adequacy or currency of the information contained in or linked to the Site. Your use of information on the Site or materials linked to the Site is entirely at your own risk. NEVER take any online advice over that of a qualified healthcare provider. Any information contained on AddictionSurvivors.org should only serve to inspire further investigation with credible, verifiable references sources such as your physician or therapist.
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Unread 03-19-2016, 06:30 AM   #13
jolter
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Yes I have for both things you mentioned. I think it helps a little. Back in July I noticed small round (silver dollar size) patches of hair falling out on back of head. I always get buzz cut then let it get long etc..
I asked sub/phyciatrist about it. He said "looks like Alopecia Areata" see dermatologist. She said same thing. Gave steroid injection in couple of spots on head a script for it. Said 95% cases stress related allthough small % could be thyroid.This stuff not working so I said if its stress related why not give me something for stress She said she couldn,t and I,d have to see PC Dr. He gave me 2 diff. scripts for aniety (stress) can't think of name. He also ordered full checkup for following week. No eating beforehand. He tested for everything thyroid included. Everything came back good eexcept liver enzimes little high but we will keep an eye on it. When I showed sub Dr.what he gave me for stress he said both were extremely small dose but guess what? Leg cramps that I got nightly for over 30 yrs just stopped completely! This was all in first of Jan. of this year. My hair will grow in one area and start falling out in another. It seems to be just on my head. May shave head completly and be done with it. I'm 59, it's not like I'm running out after work on Friday nights trying to meet girls lol.
I will work 10-12 hrs today and tommorow (weekend job) and a lot of walking so will find out for sure if pain meds will do the trick.
Wish you and everyone a great weekend!
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Unread 03-20-2016, 07:55 PM   #14
jolter
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Thought I would write and tell anyone interested how the switch is going so far.
Seems to be about eqivalent as 1.5-1.75mg of subs. Cut up so I would be dosing twice a day.
I was kind of surprised yesterday. I knew the pills weren't strong enough to mask all the WD symptoms so lets just say I was glad I was close to a rest room both Sat. and today.
Sleeping a little less but all in all not too bad.
Was not expecting this until around day 5.
So far so good. 24 days to go. I can do this!
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Unread 03-20-2016, 08:37 PM   #15
NancyB
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Hi jolter, one thing you have to remember is that bupe has a long halflife and builds up over that halflife, so some of the oxy is likely still being blocked. You could notice more effect from the oxy as the bupe works its way out of your system. Just something to be mindful of.

You can do this!

Nancy
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Unread 03-28-2016, 10:24 AM   #16
jolter
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Hi Nancy and everyone else, I hope you all enjoyed your Easter yesterday!
Nancy, its true what you wrote about the Bupe leaving my system.
I am starting to actually feel the oxy just a little bit.
I noticed this yesterday morning after I took first dose. I felt that familar feeling that I used to like about 30 min. after I took pill and it lasted for about 10-15 mins.
They have been working for pain. Enough so I can work and get around. Not 100% effective but there doing what I want until surgery.
Holidays get me down.
I start thinking about all the friends and relatives that have passed and that sort of thing. I probably should try not to think of them but its hard not too.
I started thinking how I would feel better if I chewed up several of my pills.
I fought the urge and did not do this.
I actually went to an AA meeting last night. Havn't been to one in awhile.
I had my fair share of problems with the bottle in the past and have been going to meetings off and on for yrs.
I never mentioned Subs to anyone in there.
I have tried NA several times but I did not like being told I was not truly straight if I was being prescribed subs.
I do not go along with this allthough many people do feel that way.
To each there own.
Anyways long story short, I did not take more pills then needed yesterday so when I woke up this morning I was happy with myself. (small battles).
April 13th (surgery date) is just around the corner. I wish it was sooner. Can't wait to get this over with.
I had yesterday off and also today. I will go to my night job tonight.
Thats about it.
Hope everyone has a good week!
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Unread 03-28-2016, 04:40 PM   #17
NancyB
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Hi jolter, you did a good job distracting yourself from taking more! Keep doing that. As for NA if you decide to go back to those meetings, you don't have to tell anyone any medication you're taking. It's no one's business except for yours, your doctor's and anyone you choose to tell. There are a lot of bupe patients who prefer AA to NA because AA seems to be less judgmental about medication - even though it's none of their business either.

Hang in there, you're doing great!

Nancy
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Unread 04-12-2016, 03:11 PM   #18
jas035
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Just keep fighting and never give up!
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Unread 05-10-2016, 11:28 AM   #19
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