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Unread 04-01-2013, 10:17 PM   #1
julie48
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Default Help me understand

I didn't want to monopolize anyone's thread with this question, but there is something I have never understood. I hear time and time again, sub doctors charging ridiculously high prices for office visits. I am puzzled. My doctor charge for a normal office visit which is $90.00. My insurance covers it, but for the uninsured it is still $90.00, cash. Why are these other doctors charging hundreds of dollars just to walk in their door. I am baffled and they should be ashamed knowing it is not justified. What is their reasoning, what does it entail First time I saw my doc, he took my history, etc., talked with me and prescribed me 24mg a day and that was three yrs.' ago, I am still with him (of course I am no longer on 24mg, just 4mg now but he still prescribes me 20mg. daily, I'm always ahead.) Anyway. I saw him once a week for a month, then every two weeks for two months, now I see him once every three months. He gives me my script with two refills. Did I just get lucky or are there just some crooked sub doctors out there! Thanks. Julie
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Unread 04-01-2013, 10:24 PM   #2
OhioMike
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Julie, not all doctors over charge and how many do is tough to tell. This is merely my opinion, but, bad news sells and we are a society who has become trained so to speak, to speak louder about the bad or the wrongs, rather than about the good.


My doctor charges me the same as if I had a common cold and I know of many doctors who do the same. Sadly though there are also a fair number who not only over charge, but, who will only accept cash. Frankly, they are cashing in.


We need to get two things, first the pateint limit lifted and more doctors prescribing. Those two steps would greatly reduce the doctors fees, in my opinion.
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Unread 04-01-2013, 10:27 PM   #3
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So true! Your doctor is like mine. His fee is as if I was coming in for a regular visit, such as a cold, etc. It just frustrates me to hear of so many people suffering due to the cost of the doctors on top of the subs.

What you say makes sense. Thank OM. Julie
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Unread 04-01-2013, 11:08 PM   #4
OhioMike
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Julie, my doctor and I speak often about many of these issues and it greatly frustrates and angers her what some doctors do to take advantage of their patients. She feels the same about many of the government regulations and currently she isn't very pleased with the drug company. Like me, like you and like most here, though she understands that healthcare is a business and bills much be paid, it is very upsetting when money gets in the way of healing.



Thankfully locally we have some really good doctors who are not shy about sharing these opinions and that helps us find each other decent and afforable care.


We need change and IMO, the best thing we can do is to keep pressuring our lawmakers to bring that change.
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Unread 04-02-2013, 01:29 AM   #5
manohealing
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Mine charges 190 and then crazy price for the meds. I'm going to be bankrupted from this med long before I ever truly get back on my feet. Thus is the catch with this medication, we are much healthier physically for sure.

That's so true but if more people wrote the scripts and profit margin went down, wouldn't more people stop the practice altogether. I think we need to grant every doctor the right to write scripts for these.
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Unread 04-02-2013, 04:54 AM   #6
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Hi Julie, my first doctor was a wonderful man. He took my insurance. After he passed away, I had a rough time finding another one. I had a couple of bad experiences. You may have read about them in my thread. I do have a new doctor and so far I'm pleased with how things are going. He is a psychiatrist. He doesn't take my insurance, but he charges me the same as if I were seeing him for depression or an anxiety disorder.

I believe it's a crime, if not legally then morally, the way some doctors choose to handle the treatment of this disease. If it was any other chronic illness people would be up in arms over it.

I agree with OM, get the patient limit lifted and more doctors prescribing this life saving medication. I always sign petitions when I know about one, I write my congressmen, and I vote in every election.
Cherry
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Unread 04-02-2013, 11:12 AM   #7
julie48
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Thank you for your replies. It is just a crime (morally) as was said. People are out there dying from the disease of addiction and so many doctors are profiting BIG TIME for our hell. Sure, they have to make a living, but why charge someone 190.00 for a friggin' office visit? That is sickening. It is greedy, disgusting and what goes around come around as God see the greedy and know the hearts and motives of all. I thank God for suboxone, I thank God for my recovery, and I pray HE will touch the minds and hearts of the drug makers, the doctors, and the insurance companies. Blessings. Julie
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Unread 04-02-2013, 11:44 AM   #8
gotoffmdone
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MONEY is the reason.

Personally I do not know the statistics as to why Drs get involved in the Sub business, especially those who have a built in bias against our type to start with, but my guess would be at least 50% do it for the money.

Think about it. What other patients would be willing to sit in the Drs office and pay that amount of money in cash for any other reason, even for an extensive physical. If Drs charged every patient the same as they do Sub patients for a routine monthly visit, they would most likely only see Sub patients. The other non-Sub patients would not stand for it and find themselves another physician or now days a NP or PA.

Sub Drs and Methadone clinics alike know that, as people who are addicted, we will find the cash to stay out of wds and stop the rat race of chasing pills. Go to a Methadone clinic and look at the line that has formed hours before the clinic opens only to go in and pay hundreds of dollars for a few cents worth of Methadone. You will not see that kind of line anywhere else where people often drive hundreds of miles every day to stand in that line. You can get as mad as you want or feel you are being taken advantage of, and you are, but you have one of two choices. Keep going back daily if it is a Methadone clinic or monthly if it is a Sub provider, or suffer the onset of opiate wds.

Don't think for a second those that control the scripts or medication know that. If you find a really good, compassionate and and reasonably priced Sub Dr, or one that takes the same insurance their other patients have but do not make you, as a Sub patient, pay in cash making your insurance useless, then thank your lucky stars.

There is one other thing that makes going to a Sub Dr a pleasant experience vs a monthly nightmare and that is their firewall. Better know as their staff. A good and caring staff is just as important. In a Drs office I dont know about your all's experience, but mine has been that of spending most of my time with someone other than the Dr.

wayne
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Unread 04-02-2013, 11:56 AM   #9
julie48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gotoffmdone View Post
MONEY is the reason.

Personally I do not know the statistics as to why Drs get involved in the Sub business, especially those who have a built in bias against our type to start with, but my guess would be at least 50% do it for the money.

Think about it. What other patients would be willing to sit in the Drs office and pay that amount of money in cash for any other reason, even for an extensive physical. If Drs charged every patient the same as they do Sub patients for a routine monthly visit, they would most likely only see Sub patients. The other non-Sub patients would not stand for it and find themselves another physician or now days a NP or PA.

Sub Drs and Methadone clinics alike know that, as people who are addicted, we will find the cash to stay out of wds and stop the rat race of chasing pills. Go to a Methadone clinic and look at the line that has formed hours before the clinic opens only to go in and pay hundreds of dollars for a few cents worth of Methadone. You will not see that kind of line anywhere else where people often drive hundreds of miles every day to stand in that line. You can get as mad as you want or feel you are being taken advantage of, and you are, but you have one of two choices. Keep going back daily if it is a Methadone clinic or monthly if it is a Sub provider, or suffer the onset of opiate wds.

Don't think for a second those that control the scripts or medication know that. If you find a really good, compassionate and and reasonably priced Sub Dr, or one that takes the same insurance their other patients have but do not make you, as a Sub patient, pay in cash making your insurance useless, then thank your lucky stars.

There is one other thing that makes going to a Sub Dr a pleasant experience vs a monthly nightmare and that is their firewall. Better know as their staff. A good and caring staff is just as important. In a Drs office I dont know about your all's experience, but mine has been that of spending most of my time with someone other than the Dr.

wayne
Hi, my doctor and his staff are wonderful. I am very lucky. Anyway, the only thing is doctors have a limit on how many sub patients they can have. Makes no sense, they are just being greedy IMO those who charge a ridiculously high amount to see a sub patient. Crazy world! Julie
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Unread 04-02-2013, 01:01 PM   #10
OhioMike
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Across the board the cost of the doctors is too high, when compared to a normal office visit. Now, it is true that those who choose to prescribe Suboxone do take on added cost liabilities, staffing duties and some other things, but, even with this taken into consideration, still too many either over charge or will only take cash and not accept insurance.


Lets face it, it is supply and demand. Still, as my doctor and I discuss, to many over do it and use it as a cash cow. Even so, I believe the solution lays in our laps. More doctors, no patient limit and fewer government regulations. ........... & battling the stigma in society as a whole, so others can understand that, anyone can fall victim to this disease!
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Unread 04-03-2013, 05:57 AM   #11
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It is strange to me how different countries approach the problem of addiction which, lets face it, is an extremely common and deadly human affliction (as well as rats, monkeys etc etc).

In the uk the treatment is totally free for people who cant work because of this very serious illness. They are treated, that is seen by regularly a doctor then keyworker and counselling and a central base in each county that provides the regular scripts. Free of charge with the tax payer taking on the care of patients in the hope that, when they get well again, they can become productive members of society again and this seems to happen well with the right treatment. We are, after all, all in this [world] together and it is a society problem as well. The government keep statistics to try t keep an eye on what works and what does'nt.

If a person is in employment then the patient is expected to pay (for prescriptions only, a flat fee of about £8).

I do like this approach because it takes away the need to have doctors making lots of money in their 'business'. Lots of money from misery.

If one is wealthy then of course they can go private for their scripts which will cost. Fair enough. But it is horrible that people who may be very ill are seen as a nother income stream.

We have a great deal of problems with addiction and nothing in this world is perfect but thank God for the National Health Service.

Leo
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Unread 04-03-2013, 11:59 AM   #12
julie48
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Hey Leo, how wonderful in the UK they are so concerned and care about the addiction of others. I wish it was like that here. That is not to say other's don't care, it is to say that many doctors here DO MAKE THE MIGHTY OLD BUCK OFF OF SOMEONE ELSE'S MISRY. WELL PUT!! I pray one day our nation will truly see that addiction is a disease, though many know this, they don't help us like it is a disease, not in the sense they do in the UK. Thanks for the info, very interesting. Julie
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Unread 04-03-2013, 12:12 PM   #13
OhioMike
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Locally we have treatment centers which are funded by the state and are free of charge for the poor. These centers also have Sub programs. However, their programs are not longterm Sub programs, as they strive to have the person off Sub in 6 months. Further, there are also many other free resources. Nevertheless and I dont wish to get political with this, but, we could do better. The national healthcare deal as with anything has its pros and cons. IMO, in this nation we need to take the pros from both type of systems and find productive ways for them to work together.
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Unread 04-04-2013, 12:36 AM   #14
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OMG. Don't dare mention free healthcare in this country. Any politican that does is called a socialist. Especially a democratic one. But Bush 2 was not called a socialist when he implented Medicare Part D to help seniors and the disabled with their precription cost. That is the very definition of socialism since he did not offset the cost of Medicare Part D somewhere else and thus had the govnt pay for it. He was left a surplus, got us in two wars and reduced taxes all at the same time.

They say the wealthy from other countries come to the US to get the best care. Wonder if that best care myth has anything do with the fact this country appeals to the better physicians because they stand to make a fortune here. Some governments in orient has it about right. They see teachers in a more favorable light than physicians. You can tell a country's priorities by where they put their resources, the occupations they see most important, like the shaping and molding of young minds, and in how they respect the elderly not because they are old but because they are wise. It is very easy to see a country's priority simply by looking at their policies and how the see the least of those.

When a poor man's dignity is on par with a rich man's money, as seen by those who make policy, that is a place i would call Utopia.

wayne
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Unread 04-04-2013, 12:56 AM   #15
OhioMike
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LOL, I guess this is going to get political no matter what.


So with that in mind, there is no such thing as FREE heathcare any place on this planet and honestly if anyone thinks there is, they really need to go back to school. Someone is going to pay for it.


Have fun gang. LOL
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Unread 04-04-2013, 07:17 AM   #16
Leo
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Oh I doooo love a political debate! . Would be a bit long winded for this site!

Althought I agree with Mike that there is no such thing as free healthcare. Yes, someone has to pay. But I do think that, with addcitions, the taxpayer should pay as it is surely a national crisis.

Leo (definately non-socialist apart from the NHS)
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Unread 04-04-2013, 09:19 PM   #17
gotoffmdone
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There is free healthcare for the person that does not have to pay for it. I get the fact someone is paying for it. But I also think the goverment bailouts were free lunches when part of the bailouts go for executive bonuses. Their irresponsibility in this financial meltdown we had landed no one in jail but landed more money in some of their bank accounts.

BTW what in this country is not politicized. That is always the case even in situations where 5 and 6 yr olds are massacred. Even that tragedy has become a political football. This country has never been more polarized or in trouble IMO. I worry about the country my grandkids stand to inherit. I hope if anyone of them, God forbid, has mental health issues, that by then this country sees treating patients above the neck in the same light as from the neck down.

wayne
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Unread 04-04-2013, 11:50 PM   #18
OhioMike
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Your right Wayne, too much is made political and we are in trouble because of it. Both sides, all sides are to blame and all media is to blame too, as they get sucked into pandering for one sid or the other. It seems as if extreme leanings one way or the other is al which is thought about, the power and money that brings, instead of real solutions and they are all to blame. Hell, we are to blame for letting them get away with it.


Healthcare is a good example. We need help with how to pay for it, one side doesn't offer enough and the other side offers a monster of a bill which you have to have 20 degrees and 2 years to read. God forbid they might get together and come up with some effective and straight forward solutions. Well that's how I feel.
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Unread 04-07-2013, 08:32 AM   #19
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The ensuing political debate has been moved to a new thread:

http://www.addictionsurvivors.org/vb...ad.php?t=28573
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Unread 04-07-2013, 11:33 AM   #20
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Julie, your post was moved to the new political thread which is noted in the post above.

http://www.addictionsurvivors.org/vb...ad.php?t=28573

Thanks.

Nancy
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