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Unread 12-09-2014, 11:34 PM   #51
MicheleJ
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I re-read my last post--and it sounds terrible. Everything I said was true, though, & the point I was trying to get across is that facility was just not able to address my particular needs, at all, because they deal with people with far more serious problems than I have, and to me--my issues are serious and ruining my life. But to them--they are "nonsense". Plus they are incompetent by not knowing what they're doing for a Sub taper & detox--& I had to give FOUR urine samples. Of course I'm upset. That was my chance to get better by the end of the year. Now I have to put it off longer.
The place really is horribly run, by nasty, non-caring people, though, and I don't think it helps anyone other than temporarily. It is a total waste unless the state comes up with some plans to actually help these people---The ones who really want help--that is--& the ones who are even mentally capable of receiving help. Most didn't want help, though & were not capable of receiving help. It's nothing but a glorified homeless shelter--so that's what it should be called. It most definitely should not be called a "rehab".
As far as getting insurance--What they want me to do is be completely destitute before I qualify for Medical Assistance-& use up ALL the little bit of money I have left first--and then I would qualify for it.
I don't understand the point in that. I need that money to live until I get a job that pays a living wage & pays the bills. By the time that happens, it could be too late. Then I'll be totally dependent on the "government" for not only medical care--but also for everything else. I would just die if that were to happen.
I'm thinking I'm only going to be able to afford this new insurance plan for about 2 months before I can't even pay for it anymore, anyway. Then what? I have no idea. I'll have to make sure I go to detox, rehab, all doctors appointments, mammogram, go to my periodontist, and anything else I need to get done within that time.
I got a plan with zero $$ deductible, & no charge for inpatient treatment for substance abuse. I still qualified for a hefty credit toward the monthly payment amount. There were a lot less costly plans available--but the deductibles were so incredibly high that I wouldn't have been able to afford anything at all with those plans because the deductibles were more than my total annual cost for the premium I got, and almost just as much as I have left total in my savings. Literally. And the annual out of pocket maximums were also much higher.
This is NOT affordable health care, at all. Especially for the poor people who need it--and for who the whole ACA was supposedly designed for. I am getting a good chunk off the premium in "tax credits", but it's still a lot for someone with no income, & only enough assets to live for about 2-3 months, tops.
I'll be on state Medical Assistance in no time. I also believe there is a good chance I'll end up homeless because I don't have time to wait to look for a job. Yet, I'm clearly not in any mental state to get one now, though--nor would I pass a drug test. I also have Benzos in my system now, too, from the Valium they gave me at that place. That takes weeks to get out, too.
But healthy mental state & ability to pass a drug test are my ultimate goal. At least I know I can achieve those things, eventually. With help. I can't do it alone. That's for sure.
I doubt that I'll learn anything new at any rehab--but it's just getting off Subs & having adequate time, with support, to get my head clear enough to function, & getting on proper meds--which I quite obviously can't do without insurance, & a proper after care plan. No doctors I called will help me once I tell them I'm an addict & need meds to help me get off Sub. Also--having no insurance doesn't help.
These next few weeks is going to be hell. But, I did learn a valuable lesson after being in that place I was just at--& even though to ME my life right now is truly hell on earth--I know it could be worse. I'm also scared if I don't get my shi* together once & for all--I'll end up just like those people, eventually. That's where addiction leads. I'm halfway there right now. The fact that I was there at that place at all speaks volumes as to where my life is headed. At least I won't have to suffer Sub withdrawals during this period of time while I'm waiting for insurance--but I really don't want to take anymore unless absolutely necessary.
It's hard to believe just a few short weeks ago I was interviewing for jobs, & so close to having my life back on track--& now I'm a total mess. All because of being on Sub without a legal script, & no means to stay on it--& because I can't get off of it by myself.
Now I'm isolating in my house--drinking--and a total fu** up. My only means of communicating is on the internet--and I'm basically just "talking to myself" with this thread, & these posts that I make--but at least they will serve as a "journal".
Everyone still thinks I'm "away"- & I can't even say I left that place because they couldn't help me because no one would even believe me.
I really only have one more chance. This is it. I tried to do it without spending my savings--but that didn't work out.
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Unread 12-10-2014, 02:23 AM   #52
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Unread 12-10-2014, 06:58 AM   #53
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Hi Michele, it does sound like a horrible place that's poorly run. And it's too bad that's what is considered a detox/rehab center.

Since you can't even go to rehab until January 1, start really researching what one is going to be the best that takes the insurance you'll have. Even call some and talk with them about what you're looking to accomplish. I think the other big thing is to continue working on off of Suboxone on your own. You're 4 days off now, see if you can continue that. And if it gets unbearably bad, don't even take 2mg, just take the tiniest piece possible to take the edge off of the symptoms. Get the potassium and magnesium for RLS. It would be so much better for you to be going into rehab in withdrawals, so they can treat withdrawals and not try some other crazy 'sub detox' on you. You'll be ahead of the game and then you can work on everything else with a clear head.

The other thing is that it wouldn't hurt to call that guy today to see what he says. If he says you're eligible to go try another place, find out the name and find out everything you possibly can about it. Maybe that one you were at had an opening right then for a reason - someone else may have gotten totally disgusted and left quickly too. If you can get into a better one sooner than 2 weeks, the better it will be for you. And if it's a decent one, you'll save the expense of signing up for the unaffordable insurance you're looking at now.

You can do this Michele, just don't lose your resolve, ok?

Nancy
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Unread 12-10-2014, 12:47 PM   #54
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Hi Nancy,
Thank you for getting back to me.
The insurance plan I signed up for is excellent-- & every place that accepts insurance will accept it. It's a top company (Not Aetna, though!) --zero deductible- and inpatient substance abuse treatment is "fully covered" at "no charge" to me--after deductible is met-which, like I said-- is zero deductible to meet. If there was a high deductible--I wouldn't even be able to go anywhere without completely depleting every cent I have.
But, with this plan I can pick pretty much wherever I want to go- probably anywhere in the country- (Within reason, of course-- no "Betty Ford", or "Promises of Malibu"- or anything crazy like that, I'm sure!)
I plan to go back to the detox that got me off Subs successfully a few times before. I see no reason to look elsewhere-especially with all the problems associated with Sub detox. This place worked for me--so I'd rather stick with what I know works. I'm not going to FL, though. I'm staying closer to home & going to their NJ facility.
I've also already researched & picked out what I believe will be a very good rehab to go to after detox--right here in PA. I'm still going to continue to research, though, because I certainly have the time!
This morning I started to feel pretty bad- so I took 2mg. I was extremely low & depressed, & felt my body aching, & believed worse symptoms were imminent. I wish I would have read your post about just taking a little "piece", instead. I most definitely would have tried that. Once again I had some good "time" being off of Sub & I blew it. I just feared worse symptoms were about to come. I'm still depressed- don't get me wrong, but I was even WORSE before taking that 2mg.
I'm not taking anymore Sub again, though, for as many days as I can stand it. I just felt soooooo bad & low & depressed. Maybe I can somehow wean myself off this way--going days at a time without taking any--& just taking tiny bits when needed. The less I have in my system, the better. But, then I worry about it being even harder to get off low doses, too!
My nerves are totally shot, which is why I started drinking wine-to relieve my anxiety. I know "rationally" that this is absolutely ridiculous, but my anxiety is through the roof, & I have nothing to take for it. I absolutely HATE drinking, too. I just "gulp" enough sips to keep an even keel. My goal is most definitely not to get "intoxicated". I hate being "drunk"-and won't do that. Even if I tried, I doubt I'd be able to drink enough to get "drunk". But--if I could-at least it would allow me to pass out.
I heard from the guy I used to get Benzos from--& he said he'd hook me up. He is a hard core addict. He just got cut off from one of his doctors last week because she found out he takes Methadone, & he has his sister now going to her own doctor to get him benzos & there was some issue that the doctor didn't call in her script yesterday--Big mess. I fear this is nothing but trouble. They could be being watched. I blocked his number from my phone. As much as I could use benzos for my anxiety-- I fear being arrested!!
No doctor will help me even if I go in & pay cash once they hear I'm suffering from addiction. I've called a bunch. They won't prescribe me ANYTHING at all, I was told. It's not like I even asked for benzos or anything like that. Just non-addictive meds to help me. I've thought of going in & lying- but I doubt that would work, either, & I don't want to waste the money if they aren't going to help me. The addiction psychiatrists have very long waits to get in.
I called the guy from county, at least to hear what he has to say, but no answer. I left a voicemail message. I doubt he'll even call me back, but, we'll see.
Waiting for insurance coverage on Jan 1st truly seems to be my only option. Plus I have to be here to wait for my insurance application to be processed, get my CD's out, & pay my insurance premium. I really fear I won't be able to even afford it for more than 2 months, & then I'll be cancelled--and the less costly plans that I would be able to afford for longer have such incredibly high deductibles that it's the same as not even having insurance--so what's the point? I might as well go for the platinum for my last 2 months of coverage!! Then I'll also probably get fined by the government on top of all this because I won't be able to afford to continue to pay for my insurance plan!! Yet I don't currently qualify for Medical Assistance. What do they want me to do?--Spend my last few bucks on insurance or shelter? And THEN go crawling to them!! This is absolutely RIDICULOUS!! This is what I get for being an addict & not staying off of Subs when I should have, though.
Other than taking Subs-- even though I was depressed, I truly feel like I was finally really & truly making real progress with my recovery, for the first time. I was SOOOO close. I was working again, (even though it was a crap job-- I was still "working"), no longer taking benzos, going to NA, working steps, had a sponsor, & even landed a real job. Now I feel like I'm in the pits of hell-and I have to stay here for at least 3 more weeks. That seems like an ETERNITY!! But-- at least I have HOPE--unlike those people at that place I was just at. Their lives are completely over. Maybe I was in some way "meant" to experience being there, and see first-hand how bad un-treated addiction can take people, so I could learn from it. Hearing about it, & seeing stuff on TV are NOT at all the same as witnessing it first-hand and being a "part of it".
I'm going to go get some Potassium and Magnesium, too. I hope they help.
I also only have a few more Subs in my house-like three 8mg tablets-tops. If I need more I would have to go get them out. I hope to not have to do that, though. If I can go days at a time without taking any-- I shouldn't need more than the few I have here for the next 3 weeks until I can go get help. We'll see. I certainly can't be in withdrawals for three weeks, though.
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Unread 12-10-2014, 04:37 PM   #55
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Hi,
Me again. I heard back from the head guy at County. I explained everything that happened to me at that horrible place. (I left out my opinion that the facility is really just an ineffective, extremely poorly run version of a "homeless shelter" for hopeless individuals).
He said he got a report from the place stating I was "resistant to treatment".
I told him yes, I was most definitely was resistant to taking METHADONE, and that it was absolutely impossible that there was no Suboxone in my urine--(after giving them FOUR samples-nonetheless). And that yes-- I was resistant to going directly into "rehab" without going through detox, first--because withdrawals don't start right away. I told him that I was quite upset-so I left because they weren't able to help me.
I let him know that I surely didn't spend an entire week going through this process because I "didn't want help", but that place just wasn't able to help me. I told him I have plenty of Sub of my own, & certainly didn't go there to "score Sub"-- but that I need OFF the stuff- but can't do it alone. He asked me where I currently am, & if I was in a safe place-(probably to determine if I was just seeking food & shelter--& some Suboxone!) He asked me what would be any different if he sent me somewhere else. I said hopefully everything!! And that I would hope to get detoxed-which is what I need before I can go to rehab. He also mentioned that I have some assets, and I said yes-- not a lot, though, especially since I'm not currently employed.
He said he was not going to promise me anything, but that he'd discuss with his superiors, and let me know. I got a call back about 20 minutes later that it's still no guarantee--but that he found a different place, and if they accept me I would have to go today. I said that's not an issue. He then told me I needed to call & speak to the woman in admissions at the new place he found. So I did.
I told her the same stuff I told the guy--and also that I need help with depression & anxiety, too--which the other place also REFUSED to give me. She couldn't even believe all that happened at that other place I was at. She asked me if I'm committed to staying for rehab afterwards-and I told her yes, most definitely.
She said she has to check with her supervisor to see if they can take me--if they can help me--& also told me I'd need to go today, if they can take me. So, I'm waiting to hear back from her.
I checked out the website of this new place. It seems like a normal rehab & not a homeless shelter. But, the other website didn't seem like it was a glorified homeless shelter, either.
But, if they say they'll take me-- I will go. I have absolutely nothing to lose, and it just might be the right place so I don't have to buy this expensive Marketplace insurance. If I go there--I'll know within a few days whether or not they can help me.
I still would want to at least get some insurance, though, effective Jan 1st. But, first things first. I don't even know if they will take me at this new place.
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Unread 12-10-2014, 04:55 PM   #56
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Hi Michele, I'm going to keep my fingers crossed that you can go to this place. If it's as crappy as the last and you get treated the same, then you leave again and follow through with your plan to buy that insurance. Like you said, you have nothing to lose. The other good thing is that you only took 2mg in the last 4 days, which is way better than going with having just taken 16mg.

At least it does sound promising from the way the admissions person reacted to how you were treated.

Keep me posted, ok? It would be so good if you go and it all works out!!

Nancy
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Unread 12-10-2014, 05:31 PM   #57
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I just spoke to the woman from admissions from that new place. She told me that they absolutely can NOT take me because they don't detox people "from" Suboxone who have taken it longer than 5 months because it can make people "extremely violent" and they "just don't do that" there. I did tell her how I've cut down & even went 6 days without any recently, too. (And I didn't kill anyone!!)
So-it looks like it's back to waiting for my insurance coverage on Jan 1st--if everything is properly processed by then.
I just don't understand what the issue is-- and why many facilities either don't know how--or refuse to do it--when it CAN be done. I'm extremely upset about this. I was sure they were going to take me at this place.
Going forward, I'm just going to outright LIE about how long I've been taking it. I really have no other choice at this point. I'm even going to lie to the place I plan on going once I get insurance--just in case. This is just absolutely ridiculous. How would detoxing off Suboxone make anyone more "violent" than detoxing off of any other drug? So f***ing** stupid.
By the time I get insurance-- I'll probably be an alcoholic, on top of everything else. At least I know I can get help for that!! And alcohol DOES have quite the potential to make people violent--both while on it & while detoxing from it!!!
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Unread 12-10-2014, 06:40 PM   #58
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Wow Michele, that is just crazy. Especially with the time-frame. it doesn't matter how long someone has been taking it. 5 months? What an arbitrary number! What if someone took 1mg for 6 months and someone took 24mg for 1 month. Do they really think that detoxing someone off of 24mg is going to be easier and faster than someone who has only been taking 1mg? And violent? Wow. That's one huge lame excuse.

Can you take benedryl (I have probably asked that, but can't recall right now)? It could be something to think about for your anxiety.
http://www.mayoclinic.org/drugs-supp...n/drg-20070373

"Hydroxyzine is used in the treatment of nervous and emotional conditions to help control anxiety. It can also be used to help control anxiety and produce sleep before surgery."

Valerian can also be taken for anxiety:

http://www.webmd.com/vitamins-supple...tname=valerian
"Valerian is also used for conditions connected to anxiety and psychological stress including nervous asthma, hysterical states, excitability, fear of illness (hypochondria), headaches, migraine, and stomach upset."

At this point, try to take the least amount of Suboxone possible, and stop a week before you go to rehab. There's a better chance you'll be treated for only opiate withdrawals.

So disappointing that they are clueless.

Nancy
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Unread 12-10-2014, 09:37 PM   #59
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A lame excuse?- Nancy, it's BEYOND a lame excuse. It makes no sense, whatsoever. It's nonsense- based on NOTHING . Their "reasoning" behind it is just ludicrous. It's the most ridiculous excuse I've ever heard so far--ever. "Violent behavior"? Please???! There's just no getting state funded help for this. It apparently takes $$$ to get help with this.
I called the woman back at that new place to see what was going on--she didn't call ME back. She said she called the guy at County & told him they couldn't take me- & that he was supposed to let me know. But, he never actually called & told me. Not sure if it's because it was near "closing time", or if just maybe he'll still try to find a different place for me. It was Probably just because it was near closing time that he didn't call me back.
I un-blocked "drug dealers" number-& got a hold of 35 1mg Klonopins. I need them for my nerves-- FAR better than alcohol- (which disgusts me & makes me want to puke). He knows what I'm going through, & also threw in some Lyrica- no charge. Claims he is my "friend"--Please!! Anyway, if I can hold off enough & only take them when I feel withdrawal again-they may be able to help. I don't know if I'll have the strength to do that, though-because I was severely addicted to Klonopin. My nerves are bad even without the withdrawal. I really didn't want to do this- but I need relief for my anxiety.
I finally told my roommate what happened- about how I did get the job with Aetna & lost it. He was very understanding- but it still changes nothing. He is a good person- not an addict at all. He suffers from heart problems, & doesn't know what to do for me-& I don't know what to do to help him, either. He's also unemployed due to no fault of his own, & we often argue about finances. How could we not?
Maybe I can call County guy back tomorrow & tell him I now also need help getting off of alcohol & Klonopin, now, too!! Maybe that'll work. Maybe Sub withdrawals will just get "lost" among these other withdrawals-& fears of "violent behavior" & they'll take me. I don't know. I can certainly try. It can't hurt.
If not-- I'll just have to sit tight & wait for Jan 1st. to roll around.
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Unread 12-11-2014, 06:34 AM   #60
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Hi Michele, that's a good idea telling the county guy that the Suboxone is the least of your worries since you haven't taken any and you replaced it with klonopin and alcohol. Then they don't have to find a 'specialized Suboxone detox' (and I use the word specialized very lightly...) for you.

I'm glad you told your roommate what's going on, now at least he knows and won't be speculating and you won't be totally isolating.

Again, fingers crossed that they will let you go somewhere to at least give it a try.

Nancy
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Unread 12-11-2014, 07:58 PM   #61
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Me again-
More news. I called the guy from county back first thing this morning & explained to him that I really am almost completely totallyOFF of Sub, for all practical purposes. (I really feel I almost am, actually. I take so little & so many days apart). I also told him the alcohol & now the Klonopin are becoming much more of an issue for me than the Sub right now. (Klonopin came in handy for something, after all though.) I told him that there's really no need whatsoever to continue seeking a special "Sub detox" place for me.and he agreed, (Which would have been a moot point, anyway!) (THANK YOU SO, SOOOO, SO MUCH NANCY for your advice on this).
County guy actually gave me a list of places to call to see if they had availability & would take me--although I really do feel as though I'm SOOOO close to being off of Sub--I still LIED, LIED, LIED through my teeth as to the exact nature of the history of my a Sub use--"over the years". They also believe I've never been to rehab before--which could still come back & bite me in the ass down the line. But, can't worry about that now. They at least accepted me into this detox/rehab program--which is huge-&'a lifesaver.
I'm all set, confirmed, & need to show up at tomorrow between 12pm-2pm. It's supposedly very small, and they provide detox & rehab. It's only about an hour and a half--tops-from where I live. Not sure what to expect, as usual, but time will tell. If it's not for me--I'll, leave. I really hope that's not case, though. I won't be getting any Sub taper--at all. I had to lie to get in.
I did sign up & pay for my new insurance planeffective Jan 1st. The guy knows--& actually recommended it--EVEN THOUGH he told me not too not to worry about paying for counseling when I get out--cuz it would all be covered--as long as I do well.
I'm really extremely grateful to this guy from County, though.. He didn't have to do ANY of this for me. He was really "tough & challenging", -and kind of a "dry personality", & asshole"-at first--but, as long as my intentions are what I'm presenting them to be-(which they are)-- he seems like he could be a huge help & advocate for me-as long as I do the right thing. He said he''ll be checking in every single week as to my "progress"--& that if I'm making none--he's kicking me out-with no chance for return. He said if I'm just "sleeping "& not participating" in the, programs---out the door I go!!-with no future help from the county--Ever again.
Once again, I'm grateful. I do have my 0$$ deductible Platinum insurance plan all set and paid for for Jan 1--effective date--so if things don't work out--I have that to fall back on. But this is program is GODSEND to me & hopefully I won't needed that.
I told them I need NOOO sub "taper"--but just the everyday run of the mill detox for opiates, Benzos & alcohol. Hopefully they will all offset & help each other. Detox is only for 5 days. We'll see. Time will tell.
I am going to take "little chunks" of Sub before I go--(not 2mg or anything) since it's going to have to serve as my only official taper. But better than jumping from 8mg, or 2mg !! I STILL HAVE TO DO IT ON MY OWN in order to be accepted in this place.
Ok--gotta run. Just wanted to provide an update. Hopefully the last one for 2014. Only time will tell.
Thanks Nancy for the info I emailed you about, too.
Take care.
MicheleJ
(Sorry if this is not completely in order. I'm I'm a huge rush).
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Unread 12-11-2014, 08:21 PM   #62
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Hello MicheleJ, I am sending you good wishes that this rehab will be what you need. You sure have been having tough times and I am hoping that tomorrow will be the first day that you really feel hopeful about the future. It is a start so grit your teeth and just go for it. Best of luck!!

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Unread 12-11-2014, 10:45 PM   #63
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Great news Michele! I hope this works out so you don't have to go through waiting for January 1 and your insurance.

Good luck!!!

Nancy
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Unread 12-12-2014, 02:51 AM   #64
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THANK YOU, so much, NAN! It's SOOO much appreciated that you care. It truly means a lot to me. ))
I will keep in touch' for sure.
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Unread 12-12-2014, 03:21 AM   #65
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Nancy, I cant cut myself off at even 2mg-but I'm going to to take these "slivers" as to start my own taper to get off and--Like you said-create my own taper. Hopefully with benzos & alcohol- & getting off of all of them all together--in a detox-mixed together--will help. Time will tell, as usual.
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Unread 12-13-2014, 06:45 AM   #66
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Hi Michele, I'm hoping that you're at the rehab and things are going well for you.

Nancy
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Unread 12-17-2014, 01:01 AM   #67
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Hi Nancy,
No I'm no at the rehab, and things are NOT going well.
Back home in the pits of hell-again. This time all due to my own fault.
Went to that new place-which was nothing more than a "sober living style house". Very small. Only 6 girls. Dirty- of course-as was expected- but not nearly as bad as that first place was. Men were kept separate---women weren't even allowed to speak to men. Never even saw the "men". Who cares-I wasn't there to meet men, anyway. The girls seemed okay. Nice to your face, but talked sh**behind each other's backs. The usual. It was a MILLION TIMES BETTER than that first place, though. It felt like being in someone's house-- not a detox or a rehab.
I am a heavy smoker- much, much more so recently since I've been sitting at home. Smoking was only allowed every two hours--and only ONE cigarette at a time. And I happened to have a short pack open-not my 100's. It was like not even smoking!! They literally handed each person only ONE cigarette at each smoke break.
That smoking every 2 hours didn't sit well with me to begin with, but, I figured I'd deal with it. They had me all drugged up on Phenobarb & Librium-I could barely walk. Plus all the Klonopins I had taken & alcohol I drank before I left didn't help my balance either, I'm sure.
Of course because I was craving nicotine so badly, I wanted to leave shortly after I got there. But--it was all worked out & I was determined to accept the one cigarette every two hours rule--even though that rule made no sense to me. It was suggested that I go into my bed and sleep, and my roommate promised to never let me sleep through a smoke break.
So, after the first time she woke me up to smoke, some staff member started screaming that someone had smoked inside in one of the bathrooms, and therefore- NOONE was getting their smoke break.
What I should have done-- since I was drugged-up & half asleep anyway--was just have gone back to my bed & gone back to sleep until the next smoke break. That's what any logical person would have done.
But, that's not what I did. I was craving nicotine so badly-especially since my nicotine levels were way down, & I was woken up specifically to smoke- so, I threw a fit. I demanded that they get me all of my belongings because I was leaving, IMMEDIATELY. And that's just what they did. They wouldn't let me use a phone,(luckily my battery still had charge left) and they put my stuff outside on the streets & wouldn't even let me wait indoors until my roommate got there to pick me up--(over an hour a way--in the FREEZING cold.) I'm SHOCKED they just "let me go"--out on the streets like that- in the condition I was in-& especially after they gave me all those drugs!. They even went in my room at night while I was asleep to give me doses of Phenobarbital & Librium. What if something would have happened? I could have gotten hit by a car or something.
I wasn't even fully out the door & I realized I had made a terrible mistake & apologized, & asked if I could still stay. I was flat out told "NO". That I must "deal with the CONSEQUENCES" of my actions". It's not like I made any trouble while I was there, or anything. People do far, far worse things than what I did at places like that. (People were fighting & security had to be called at the first place I was at--& THEY didn't even get kicked out!!).
I was wrong for telling them I was leaving because I couldn't smoke, yes- however, I think that it could have been handled differently. At least put me on some type of warning, or something. But, that's not what happened. It is what it is. I wasn't even there a full 24 hours!!
It was Friday when I got there-Sat when I got back home. I tried calling the guy from County on Monday to talk to him. He wasn't in the office-- but I talked to his superior, who told me that they will not even CONSIDER funding me for treatment for at LEAST 90 days--if at all ever again. I never even received ANY "treatment"--so it couldn't have cost them anything. I tried calling the guy from County to speak to him today- since I was told he'd be back today (Tuesday)-- he would not even return my phone calls.
The "first time" I left (from that crazy place)- I had no choice. The place was a zoo. But to react the way they did over "smoking" at that 2nd place- was uncalled for. Plus I apologized & asked to stay. I'm sure I'm not the only one that's been upset about that. But-- since I was being funded by the county-- I guess that made a difference, and they assumed I wasn't serious about wanting treatment-and that they would rather "fund" someone else who is "more serious". Ridiculous. Over SMOKING CIGARETTES!! As if that made me not really want help! I still have no one else but myself to blame for the incident, though. I handled it badly.
So, I've just been sitting at home, again, going nuts. Smoking. Didn't take anymore Sub. I was such a wreck & so intoxicated when I got home Saturday- I ended up getting a bottle of Ativans from a friend of a friend, (not a dealer) just to help me come down off all that crap they had me on. I made it last for 3 days, too.
I continued to "firm up" & confirm my insurance (that I'll only be able to afford for 1-2 months, anyway!), and that is all set. I spoke to the insurance company and even got my ID number & group number- double checked my payment was up to date & correct. I'm all set up & logged into the insurance company website so if I need to print out a temp card if for some reason mine doesn't get here on time-- I can do that. Everything is set. NOTHING CAN GO WRONG. I will DIE if this doesn't happen. LITERALLY.
I picked the exact place I'm going to. I won't need a separate detox because there is one already there. It's a place here in PA. It's a place that has a psychiatrist who will prescribe me antidepressants, there's an aftercare program with a sober living house nearby the facility. And smoking is allowed ANYTIME AT ALL that there is free time. None of this every 2 hour bullcrap. We are ADDICTS. We need to smoke. It's just as hard giving up the cigarettes as it is giving up drugs-yet alone while detoxing off of drugs. I don't see how people go to detoxes in states that don't permit smoking. Period. That's why smokers all flock to other states for rehab.
Like I said-- I've hardly been taking ANY Sub. I took that 2mg last time I wrote about it, & then a "sliver" since then. I think I have almost weaned myself off. Not without any effects, though.
The Benzos helped tremendously, but, even still, I've been getting more & more severely depressed every day as the Subs are leaving my system. Tonight I was actually very "nasty" to my poor roommate & very "edgy". My eyes would not stop watering, I was fearing the RLS, and I was ready to once again say the hell with it-- & just go right back on Subs. I still have two whole weeks to sit around and wait until I can go to a real rehab. Two weeks is nothing to people who have lives, who are living their lives, working, and especially for those looking forward to the holidays. To ME--two weeks is an ETERNITY. There are no holidays for me this year. None. I don't watch TV because it depresses me- but if my roommate has it on & I hear a Christmas song- I go & turn it off.
I can't even tell my mom, son or sponsor I'm back, again. I don't want them to worry, nor do I feel up to speaking to them or seeing them right now. I'm a wreck. Not sure if I mentioned this or not- but I got a hold of my sponsor on the way to the first place I went to, & she said she will still be my sponsor. We have a lot to talk about - of course- but she didn't just get rid of me.
Since I felt so bad again tonight, & really didn't want to go fully back on Sub, I decided to try taking some Percocets again- just to see. I was shocked that they actually worked! Not as much as they usually would have-- but- my tolerance is pretty high, too. But at least I feel normal again. So- some of the Sub must FINALLY be getting off the receptors-which makes me happy.
I also--by sheer luck & chance- located a bottle of 100 Vicodins. (Also not from a dealer). Not the strong ones- just the 5mg or whatever. I have to pick them up in the morning, & only have to pay the actual cost of the script. I figure if I can get through the next 2 weeks taking them, instead of Subs-- that it'll be helpful in the long run. It'll be MUCH Easier to detox off Vicodins than Subs. I'm going to detox, anyway. I found 2 dilaudes,I forgot I had, too. I never took them before. & I still have about 5 benzos left- for emergency only. I hope this will get me through the next two weeks until I can get to detox. I don't want to have to start drinking alcohol again just to calm my nerves. It's disgusting--& it was making me bloated!
I have to go clear out my CD's & lock the cash up tomorrow, too.
I called & I can have everything set up at the rehab so that I'm ready to actually GO on the first-- instead of not even calling until the 1st-- when my new insurance plan is effective.
I really have no other plan. I don't even know what'll happen after I get out- but I know I need help & can't do this on my own. I can't believe I *****d this thing up over cigarettes-either. How stupid. But, without a doubt, I'll get much better treatment where I'll be going- if I have to find a positive in it. And, if I didn't go through this- I wouldn't have gotten a speedy denial from Welfare for Medical Assistance to speed things up in time for Jan 1st coverage through Marketplace. I'd probably STILL be waiting to see if I was approved or denied!
So, back in a mess- two more weeks. Subs ARE going in the trash- once I actually leave for rehab. I can't be tempted by them when I get back, & I can't afford to take them long term- or take ANY drugs. They are ruining my life. I'll have to quit smoking eventually too-can't afford that, either.
My roommate got a job, though. A really good one. I'm happy for him. I'm still worried about his health, but he'll be getting health insurance soon, I hope.
So, this is my latest update- and sorry your not quite rid of me, yet. A little over 2 more weeks & you'll be rid of me again for a while. 15 more days!!
Even though this is anonymous over the internet-- I still really almost didn't even want to tell what happened-- about how I lost my opportunity at free rehab over cigarettes. It's extremely embarrassing. And just because that happened- that in no way implies that I'm not serious about needing help. They (the County) just don't see it that way.
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Unread 12-17-2014, 06:07 AM   #68
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Hi Michele, that's too bad it didn't work out. It's really too bad that the place didn't at least have nicotine patches or gum to offer people who smoke a lot. But that's in the past. Just move forward. At least you have everything set up and ready to go on January 1. Does the new place has all of your information - including your insurance ID numbers already so there's no doubt you'll be admitted right away?

One suggestion. Get rid of all the sub now. You have the percocet and the vicodin. There's no point in having the bupe around, especially because you could risk going into precipitated withdrawals if you decide to take bupe and it's too soon. And no sense being tempted, especially as the first draws closer.

You have to find things to keep yourself occupied for the next couple of weeks. Can you go to the library and take out some books or even movies to watch? Anything to keep your mind from constantly focusing on how you're feeling and perhaps to help time go by.

I know it's trite to say, but you can do this, just keep looking at the help you'll get on the first.

Nancy
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Unread 12-17-2014, 10:41 AM   #69
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Hi Michele,

Well, again I am sorry that your life is so...complicated. Especially sorry that you're feeling so crummy. Miserable is probably more accurate. Sorry for the misery you're feeling.

Truth is, what I'm about to suggest to you might just piss you off, at me. I don't want to make you angry, especially since you have so much anger and rage in your life already.

But still.....

You wrote, in more than one previous post, that "this time" you were NOT going to rebel (paraphrased)...that since your way had not worked in the past, no matter how crappy those rehabs might be, no matter what!, you were going to do things THEIR way.

Thing is, as in the past, that wasn't a true statement. It is true, I believe, that we are the "architects of our own demise," our own worst enemy, as it were.

And good Lord, Michelle, you really are one self destructive person. Oh, not unusual among addicts. Hell, I was the King of Self Destruction, I was indeed. I destroyed so many good things in my life that I am still, now many years later, freakin ASTONISHED by how self-destructive and, most especially, how effin' delusional I was.

This NEXT time, Michele, I URGE you to reject every first thought that comes to your mind when presented with a problem, or a question, issue, complication, etc., etc. by the Rehab Staff. Whatever you first WANT to say/reply? DON'T say it.

This next time, now just a few weeks away, I urge you to do what you promised you were going to do with those other Rehabs: Do What You Are Told To Do. Even if you don't agree. Especially if you don't agree.

We have proven, we addicts, that when we're in the chaos of our active addictions, we rarely know what's good for us.

So? So this time, do what you're told to do. I mean, really--you can't be any worse off than you are now by cooperating with them, right, wrong, whatever.

Ok, that's enough.

Michele? You don't have to live in chaos any longer. Problems, drama and anger does NOT have to define you, does not have to be the center of your life.

Peace and acceptance, they are an option.

Inside you, Michele, there beats a good and kind heart. Inside you, dear, is a woman who wants to live a meaningful and a purposeful life. I think this is true.

Please, consider this: Stop fighting the world. Surrender. No, not "give up." Surrender. Surender your power over the world. Cause truth is, ain't none of us got any kinda omnipotence.

Do what is suggested to you. Nah, do what you're told to do. Hell, it might just be that those folks actually, for real 'n true, know what's what.

I wish you the best, Michele. I hope you know that.

sam b
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Unread 12-17-2014, 11:26 AM   #70
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Great post Sam. No offense Michelle until one wants to get clean and quits making excuses for why one isn't clean they are never going to get clean. Just saying I didn't get clean over night.... It took almost 2 and a half years of group, seeing my sub dr. And working a program. I changed every single thing in my life, friends, diet, exercise. Ect... I've even quit smoking.
I had to do a lot to work on ME while in a suboxone program. I had a ditch mind that was very self centered because truly as addicts we all have the ditch mind. The easy thing would be continuing to use and screw around but when one is truly ready to get clean, the easiest thing for me was to get out of the ****ing ditch and start living. With that being said, unless you truly want to be clean, quit making excuses and decide to put the work in and do it! The best rehab in the world isn't going to get you clean unless YOU want it! That's one choice right now that you can still control.

Anyway best of luck.
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Unread 12-17-2014, 11:54 AM   #71
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Good morning,
Back to my routine of "journaling" & talking to Nancy-the main one here for me during this most horrific time in my life.
Just read your posts Runner & Sam Bailey. I'm not mad. What you both said is true. That first place they sent me was a sh**show. The 2nd one I fu**ed up- which I fully admit. I still only have my one last shot left.
I do disagree on the quality of care that one can receive at one place versus another--one place could provide much better trestment, while the other one much worse. But, you're both right in that no matter where anyone goes-they have to want it. Just because I had a hissy fit over smoking--that I apologized for & tried to Correct-does NOT mean that I'm not ready & dont really want help. Thats ridiculous to say such a thing. And- as I was bluntly told- I'm now dealing with the CONSEQUENSES of my actions.
I know my thoughts are not usually right-which I spoke of further down in this post-before I read your two posts. Specifically I mentioned how I know going to a recovery house after rehab for at least 60 days is what I need- yet I know when the time comes--I won't want to. All I can say is I hope I learned enough from my past mistakes & have the strength to do the right thing when the time comes. I plan to-sure- but like you said- plan to, or hope to- don't matter. It will be what I actually DO when the time comes.
Life totally sucks now- but I'm well aware there will also be a lot of hard times ahead, as well as hard work. This will be the hardest thing i ever have to do. But the ONLY thing that matters because if i dont do it- life is over.
I am out of Percocets- I only had a few left to begin with. I had a few Vicodins this morning, but have to still go pick up that script. 100 sounds like a lot--or "enough"- for two weeks- but not when I take them 3-5 at a time-numerous times per day. I'll barely squeak by the next two weeks. I just can't do that, though. It's that simple. I can only take a certain allotted amount per day-& that's it. My roommate will have to control them for me.
But my God-- I feel like I just may finally be off of Subs, at least. That makes life much easier in regard to finding a detox and detoxing. There wouldn't even "BE" an issue locating a detox for Vicodin. I'm sure there is still Sub in my urine, and will be of a while, but receptor-wise, I feel I've made progress. There's so many drugs in my system now it's ridiculous. Subs, Percocet, Vicodin, Librium, Valium, phenobarbital, Klonopin & Ativan. Disgusting. Absolutely DISGUSTING.
I can tell you- all this "addictive thought behavior" is immediately back, too. Even if only for two weeks. The feeling like crap when I woke up this morning until I took something, (at least I had something to take) the counting and "rationing" of these extremely short acting pills, worrying if I'll have enough, plotting where I could get more if I run out, should I go to the ER claiming to be in pain if I run out? How I'll make them last, etc. didn't miss ANY of this crap. I never want to live like this again. NEVER, EVER. EVER, again.
Nor do I ever want to be so extremely physically dependent on a medication like Sub that I can't afford & is so hard to get off of. (For me). I don't want to be a slave to any drugs. (Just antidepressants). I just have to now learn how to live without drugs or Sub, and I will. I must always remember November & December of 2014--when my life became the worst it's ever been due to drugs. It was happening all along over the past two years exactly to the date- I just didn't notice it until pretty much all at once. The Aetna job caused me to seriously wake up. Now I'm broke & it's going to be a lot harder to "come back"-- although I do see that it could be far, far worse after my "stay" in the drug rehab/homeless shelter-after seeing a lot of the people there.
Vicodins give me energy- so I already have the motivation to clean up around the house, (as long as the effects last) and I will do all my laundry & be completely packed for when I leave for rehab. I'll keep busy that way. And try to sleep a lot. Just get through each day of hell. I do have some books, too, yes.
For some reason watching TV makes me so depressed-- watching other people who have normal lives, living their lives, without catastrophic things to worry about-- like addiction, withdrawals, having no money, becoming homeless, and having no idea what lies ahead in the future. (Whatever lies ahead-- it has to be better than where I'm at now, though).
I put money into CD's 5 years ago expecting to just keep rolling it over for retirement- or put it into a money market or something. NEVER did I expect to have to use it for health insurance to go to DRUG REHAB--for the millionth time!! But I'm fortunate I have it. If I didn't, I would be done. It will also be enough to pay for a decent sober living house after I get out of rehab, my car insurance & phone. Not much else, though. I did have to take some out this past spring after the incident with my car, or else I would have more left than I do. I'll need to get a job ASAP, too, of course.
Since my roommate got a job- he'll continue taking over the payments of the house. I even told him I will sign the house over to him for $1 if he will take it. I have nothing but bad memories here. From the minute I moved in.
It's an older house- I had big plans on fixing it up. I already put tons of money in big things into it- like switching oil to gas, getting Air conditioning, new floors, & fuses to circuit breakers. Nothing cosmetic though- so it still looks old. I'll never recoup the money I put into it. If my roommate likes it-- & also needs a place to live- he should have it. My son hates the house- & lives in mid-town Manhattan with his attorney father. This is far, far below his standard of living. So, I wouldn't feel any guilt there by not giving it to him. He'd probably be angry if I "stuck him" with it, anyway.
But, maybe it's really me who needs to change- & has nothing to do with the house at all. I don't know, though, because I've had more than one or two therapists tell me not to come back here-but of course I didn't listen. We'll see. Nothing I need to worry about today, though. As long as my 2 cats are able to come with me-wherever that may be- & whenever that may be-all will be well. If not, i know they'll be taken care of.
My roommate said that once my head is straight & I'm well- since he did get this job, we would be okay even if I just get a $10-$12/hr job for a while. I'd be lucky to get such a job at this point-when I'm ready. I Can't do anything until I'm drug free & have a clear head, though.
I really don't think just a 30 day stay & returning home immediately afterward will be beneficial, enough though. I feel I will need more time around recovering people-(In addition to just going to NA Meetings) like at least 60 days in a recovery house. I made that mistake before, & look how it turned out! I know when the time actually comes to move into a recovery house- I won't want to. I'll want to come home. But I also know that would be a mistake. (Just thinking out loud-or in writing).
Yes, Nancy, I did speak to the rehab about my insurance and tried giving them all of the numbers & info. However, they said it's too soon for all of that. The earliest I can get them that info is the 30th or 31st. I even tried to make a reservation. I guess too many things could change-insurance wise- between now & then, so that's why it's too soon. I am paid up, though, and will even pay for an additional month before I leave-- just in case. But that's probably all I'll have enough for unless I get a really good job!!
Other than zero deductible & no charge for inpatient rehab-- it's really a crappy plan, with high co-pays for EVERYTHING. But, my Main goal was getting in some place without having to Meet thousands of dollars in deductibles, first. So thats why I went with the one I did. It's actually silver-not platinum-or whatever.
Now, can you please explain what'll happen if I end up taking Subs again? I'll go into precipitated withdrawals? I want to throw them out today. I just worry if something goes wrong with my plan, I may need them until I am able to get into rehab. Although I don't foresee anything at all going wrong with my plan-but ya' just never know. But, if you can tell me exactly what bad things will happen if I take them again- it will serve as the greatest deterrent. I have also given them to my roommate & told him to hide them & then throw them out as soon as I'm on my way to rehab. I remember learning about that a long time ago- but since it hasn't been an issue- I never thought too much of it lately-until they wanted to put me on METHADONE at that place! So thank you for reminding me of this, Nancy.
Do you think it's safe to say most of it is off my receptors? Could there still be "some" Sub still on them? Or once it's off-is it all off? How does that work? I went 6 whole days before without taking any Sub- & Percs were ineffective. It's been less than six days now, & they are effective again. Although I was skipping more days than taking-& taking extremely small doses. Did I really get myself off? (Still sick- but "technically" off Subs & back on Vicodin- like where I was 5 1/2 years ago when this started?)
What an incredible turn of events since even just 5 days ago. My roommate also go a call & he starts his new job tomorrow. So I'll be here all alone all day, every day now, too, pretty much until I leave for rehab in hopefully 15 days.
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Unread 12-17-2014, 12:39 PM   #72
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Hey Michele,

Your life is NOT over. You CAN come back for that Ring of Hades you've been living in. Time, patience, courage, wisdom, humility, all those-kinda-things? You'll need to summon up all those bad-boys into your life. But really, you can do it. No doubt.

One thing, for what it's worth, realllly think hard about making major decisions in your life (i.e. your house dealio) right now. As in, think about NOT making any major decision you don't really need to make. Save that thinking for when your head clears up.

Clarity will come to you, Michele---but not, like, in a coupla days. Once again, think TIME. Give yourself some time to heal. Be kind to---You!

Oh, and a second thing, re the Vicodin: do your best to take ONLY what you have to take to keep from being sick. Oh man, I was TERRIBLE at doing that. Worse than terrible, to be honest. Yet it can be done. YOU can do it. But really, don't use those Vics to get all warm 'n comfy. Don't use them to get loaded; use them to stay out of withdrawals. Best you can.

100 Vics? That can work for you. Back in my bad ol days, 100 Vics would last me a day and a half. maybe two if I was disciplined. Disciplined? Ha!

A coupla times though, I actually succeeded in making a supply last. You CAN do this, you CAN make 'em last until you go to the Rehab.

Anyway.

You are thinking a little better, seems to me. Hope that didn't sound, like, condescending. Don't mean it that way.

best,

sam b
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Unread 12-17-2014, 09:54 PM   #73
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Hi Sam,
Thanks for getting back to me.
Yeah-taking Vikes just to stay out of withdrawals isn't my strong point, either. I actually feel physically ok--I took 10 today- can't do that every day. Thing is-they no longer give me quite the "energy" they used to, or quite as "warm & fuzzy" feeling as they used to. No desire to clean the house as I expected, and as soon as they wear off--I feel soooo depressed. Not that I don't feel depressed while taking them-because still I do. But it's just way worse. Last night before I tried taking opiates again & almost went back to taking Subs, in addition to feeling physically bad--I thought I was going to have a nervous breakdown. I'm not THAT bad with taking the Vikes. Not at all. At least I'm in a "calm" state. (Not that I was "violent", though!!)
Things are just too bad to actually "enjoy" drugs in any way-anymore, I think. They've ruined my life. No matter how I try to rationalize or be in denial-even temporarily by using drugs-it just doesn't work because the reality is life sucks now-and not even drugs can mask it any longer.
Best they can do is get me through the anxiety, loneliness & depression & ward off physical withdrawals. Which is what they're SUPPOSED to be used for right now. My tolerance is high now--(probably nothing compared to other addicts-or heroin users-but for me--it is what it is) and I imagine in a few days I would need to take 10 to have the same effect as 4 do now. & it's not even that great. But yet I still feel I could not live these next two weeks without these stupid pills. Do you know what I mean?
I think about things I have no control over & that I can't change--like my old life, how good it was, my finances,--today I had to go cash out my CD's, & that really hit home. That was "extra money" I literally had laying around 5 years ago. Now it's ALL I have left to my name--& no income. That's IT!! It depresses me so much.
I'm worried that something is going to go wrong with my insurance and I won't be able to go to rehab--even though I purposely got a policy with zero deductible & no charge for inpatient substance abuse treatment. I worry my roommate is going to lose his job he hasn't even started yet-- foolishness!! Yes!! I know!! But this is where my mind takes me. I also wonder if I really am in love with my roommate.
I try to think that things WILL get better--not anytime soon--but that as long as I don't use, follow direction, a program of recovery--things will be ok again, eventually. I wonder where I'll be next year this time. Hopefully enjoying the holidays-instead of isolating & hibernating from the world. This is horrible. It has to get better.
I have so much fear, anxiety & depression. And I'm 45--I should have "gotten this" by now--before things got this bad-at my age.
I'm embarrassed to be my son's mother being like this. This is shameful to him-plus causes him to worry about me. And same with my mom-which Causes me guilt.
My family are very "upper-middle class", very "prim & proper" (too prim & proper if you ask me!) they all have money-and careers-big, fancy homes, -Lexuses in their garages-not one-but 2! Or BMW's, and that's what's valued in my "family". My stepfather owns his own international import-export business, (which he also included my sister & brother in on it--but never me). My brother is a stock broker on Wall Street-my sister in law is a veterinarian internist specialist--my sister & brother in law work the family business in the UK. My ex is an attorney. I--on the other hand--am a drug addict who can't even find a $12.00/hr job that wouldn't even allow me to live, anyway!! I'm a disgrace to them-so I avoid them. Our worlds "clash"! To say the very least!
I was never raised with them, though, I was left behind when they all moved overseas when I was 11-& raised by my verbally abusive grandmother. So--it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out how we ended up so differently. (They are actually my 1/2 brother & 1/2 sister) Now, though, they are the only "family" I have, and, I don't feel a part of their family. Never have. Probably never will.
Even when I had my good job (to me) and money-(to me) I still never felt like I compared to them--& still often avoided them. We used to travel-went on a family trip to Paris a few years ago--I can't possibly be included in such things anymore. My mother actually LIED to me about an international family trip they all took within the past year because they knew I couldn't afford to go. My sister let it slip. That's how I found out. I confronted my mother-& she told me she didn't want me to "feel bad". Well--I felt bad!! I used to also go & visit my sister in the UK every year, too. No more!!
(PITY PARY AT MICHELEJ's! All invited!!) Don't know quite how I got on that topic!)
Anyway, I found a big bottle of Seroquil while going through my safe--maybe I can pass a few days away just sleeping until it's time to go. I also found about 8 Clonodine. (Wish I knew about those a few weeks ago!!) That would stretch the Vikes out-get more Sub out of my system-& be good for me -to get rest-and be unconscious. It'll help to make the Vikes last-especially if I can't go exactly on the 1st. As it is now, I can only take 6 Vikes per day. I should try to take less-in case I can't go right on the 1st. Although I'll do my hardest to try to go on the 1st. I'll be calling on the 30th! This is not what I should be doing with my life!! Worrying about PILLS!! Oyyyy!!
Such a huge setback. This all started December 2012--here it is-December 2014--& things are worse than I EVER imagined they could be. Not just financially- but also how I feel. Completely depressed. And I THOUGHT I was depressed then!!
I'm going to think positive thoughts, though. I can't let my "family" define who I am as a person. (I learned that at rehab). I need to find peace within myself. And compared to where I am now- just being able to have a job, pay my bills, have a place to live and have inner peace would be priceless. I've travelled the world- at least I can say I did that. I had a good life at one time. But I was never really at peace with myself. That's the only thing that's going to save me, and keep me off drugs, I think. But, if I know all of this? Why haven't I found it yet?
I really thought I was on my way-going to NA-working steps-working on changing my faulty thinking-and even got a half decent job-but because I was taking Sub without a legal script-that didn't happen-& then that's when the sh*t hit the fan!! And the urgency to get off Sub immediately occurred.
That, then, caused a wide range of events to occur--rather quickly-and caused me to think about how bad things really are-and how I still am not better, and still need help. Which spiraled further out of control by abruptly stopping taking Sub, with additional drug use & even alcohol-which has screwed me up even more. Plus getting myself off Sub certainly isn't helping matters any-the withdrawal. But I am proud of my progress in regard to getting myself off. But now I'm dependent on Vicodin, again-which is where I was 5/12 years ago when I first got on Sub.! (At least I THINK I'm off Sub, now. Who the he*l knows, though!! All I know is it IS one fine mess!!
Nowhere to go but UP from here. In two weeks.
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Unread 12-17-2014, 11:34 PM   #74
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Sam Bailey,
I was just reading some of your threads/posts. I read a bit about your son's addiction to alcohol, and that he picked up his 60 day chip back in October. How is he doing?
I can relate-my son is only 18-and has already been addicted to weed, alcohol, and tried pills & heroin.
He's been actively involved in AA in NYC for two years now-since he was 16. He gets so much "time"- then F's up-but he always keeps going back. He has over 90 days now. We actually went to a meeting together the night before a Thanksgiving.
I am so hopeful you'll write back with good news about Noah, and that he's continuing to do well.
It is extremely disheartening being on the other end- of addiction--as the parent of an addict, especially knowing we are helpless to help our children who are suffering.
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Unread 12-18-2014, 06:36 AM   #75
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Hi Michele, I know I probably don't have to say this, but I will anyways. Please be careful with the Seroquel, especially with vicodin and clonidine. When did you last take Suboxone? It's been a while now, if I'm not mistaken.

It's good that you keep writing. You're uncovering, or bringing to the forefront, things you need to work on. Don't ever judge yourself against anyone else. You are you, and you are the only one you have to be happy with. Comparing yourself to anyone else, family nor not, doesn't do anyone any good. It probably is very hard not to do that now, but when those thoughts start creeping in, redirect them to how you are going to get better, have a better life, and hopefully find real help for your depression. You also brought up your roommate, that's good that he's being so helpful but don't worry about his job. That's his thing. Concentrate on yourself and what you need to do to get better.

You might want to take a peek at that CBT site to see if it's of any help to you.
https://moodgym.anu.edu.au/welcome
It could be a start in learning how to change your way of thinking.

You'll get there with the proper help.

Nancy
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Unread 12-18-2014, 02:42 PM   #76
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Hi Nancy,
Yes, this is my current form of "therapy", writing on here every day during this period time in my life. I also consider this to be "journaling". Besides my roommate, and bill collectors who call--you & the people on this forum are the only people I communicate with right now. Literally. I have chosen to completely isolate myself from everyone in the real world right now for different reasons. Maybe I'll print out all of my posts & take them along to rehab with me. Also, writing these posts takes up a good amount of time-& helps the days go faster, too. It's really therapy for me.
First-I don't feel like carrying on a conversation with anyone. What if people want to talk about the holidays. I have nothing to say about them other than I just want them to be over with. I used to go all out-over -the -top-decorate the day after Thanksgiving-shop for everyone starting in October. I haven't even put up my tree for 3 years now. I can't even get my cats a X-Mas gift this year. Or, if people want talk about how they hate their job--or love their job--as people do--I don't have a job, and honestly just can't pretend to even care what they think of their job right now. If they want to go to lunch, I can't afford such a "luxury" right now. I can't pretend to hold any interest in what people have to say right now. Period. End of Story. It's all about me-& I can't help it. That's how I truly feel. Nothing matters until I can get better.
Especially my mom. Her & her "Alanon/Merry Sunshine" attitude-that I am too "negative", I need to be "positive", I'm constantly reminded that it's my fault I'm where I'm at. (True-but do I really need to hear it constantly?) she says things like: "If all you can do is get a job at McDonalds, then you need to "accept that", and just be positive about it and keep looking-because you have no other choice. "At least It's a start"---she'd say.
A START? I'm a 45 year old college educated woman with a mortgage. I could NEVER "accept" working at McDonalds as a long-term career, and most certainly not EVER be "positive" about it. And, hearing that from HER--actually ANGERS me. If someone else said it--I'd probably still not like it, but it wouldn't actually make me angry.
That's a great "start"--for someone who is 16!! That wouldn't even pay my phone bill! Especially with how I told you my family is. I'd be the laughing stock-working at McDonalds. I would never show my face again around them if that was the case. If McDonalds paid a living wage-I would then be able to at least possibly begin to "accept it"- temporarily.
There are 2 Lexuses sitting in the garage at my step fathers--he's overseas for business, a lot. Most of the time, actually. Doesn't use them both even when he's here! My sister & brother don't even have to ask permission to drive either one. Ever. When my car was broken down--even before they were aware of my "drug addiction"-- I was NEVER even allowed to THINK about driving one. I totally feel like I don't belong around those people.
I honestly believe if I was to lose my home, even if years along in recovery & doing everything right--my mother would let me go to the homeless shelter so I can "learn a lesson" of some sort. (If I got a job at McDonalds, I would most definitely end up in a homeless shelter!!) Meanwhile--she's currently re-doing the entire lower level of her house because my sister in law is having a 2nd baby--and even though they only stay with her once a year or so--she feels they need an "extra bedroom" when they are there, so they can be "comfortable" and have enough "privacy". Can you imagine? I just can't be around all that excess when I don't even have money to properly go grocery shopping. It's not good for me. It makes me feel very bad about myself.
When my sister visits from the UK every year-my mother spends WEEKS getting the house ready, shopping, buying new linens & bedspreads, new decorations, buying all fresh ORGANIC everything because my sister won't eat anything that's not organic-and cooking all of her favorite things. If she forgot to buy one small insignificant ingredient-- she'll run out in the rain to go pick it up! Treats my sister like she's the Queen of England- even though my sister can be very bitchy & nasty to my mother. When she invites me over for dinner--"Sorry. I don't have anything to drink but water. That'll have to do". It's the point of it all.
I know I do not deserve any handouts-especially at my age-especially because of addiction--nor have I asked for any. But, it's not like she can't afford it. You think just "maybe" she'd offer to buy me a winter coat, that she knows I need--as long as I'm not knowingly using drugs & working on recovery. Or some small token like that. Nope. I haven't even received a birthday gift from her in two years. Yet--every year--even this year-as broke as I am--I always at least get her something small. She loves books-so I usually get her a book if I'm broke. Or maybe she could pick up a bottle of Vitamin Water when she invites me over to dinner!!
Ironically enough, the Saturday I told her I was not well, and going to that first "state-funded rehab" I went to, I think she was going to buy me a winter coat--cuz she kept talking about it that morning, that Macy's was having their Friends & Family Sale-& she said she was sure I'd be able to find a coat, & then told me we would go somewhere nice for lunch, after. Then when I told her I was not well & going away, & that yes--I had been taking Suboxone-again-she just started crying. I told her I'd still need a coat when I get back- Then when I came back from the first place-before I went to the 2nd place--she had contempt in her voice. She doesn't want to hear anything I have to say-doesn't believe me. That first place was horrible!! No matter how desperate I am. She didn't even want to hear all what happened & why I left. But then she left me a very "sweet" voicemail message as I was on my way to the 2nd place- that she loves me, wants me better, etc. I believe that's all true, but I still can't get past how I'm treated differently- and "less than" the others.
As fas as she knows, I'm still at the 2nd place. I don't see any point in telling her otherwise. Especially the reason I'm not still there-because of smoking!! Because to her-because I took Suboxone--the most evil drug on the planet, according to her-I'm right back where I was, & I'm a no good drug addict. But--even before all this--I was still treated differently. Much, much differently. And-- while I was taking Suboxone-again- she kept telling me how "good" I looked-the "best in years", as a matter of fact. And I wasn't engaging in ANY addictive thoughts or behaviors-like I am now. But I WAS taking Subs.
Then there's the whole story of my son--not even going to go there.
Although that's all actually true now-I am right back where I was because of all the other drugs I've taken since then, and because of how depressed I am. I am in active addiction right now. No doubt. She honestly must think I enjoy using drugs & being an addict, or something. If she was depressed-& had something laying around that would help-I wonder if she'd take it? She's such a prude that she prides herself on not even taking Tylenol if she has a headache!
But before this incident where I didn't get that job--I was doing everything right as far as my recovery. (Except yes, I was still taking Subs without a legal current script). I was working at minimum wage crap jobs. Going to NA-had sponsor- Started steps. Constantly looking for work & trying to have a positive attitude. Even got a job. I don't understand how everything changed so drastically-so quickly. It baffles me.
It's not like I didn't try to go to a doctor & get proper meds--to avoid having to go away to detox, & rehab. Again. But as soon as they heard I am an addict--they flat out told me they refused to prescribe me ANYTHING. Not even anti-depressants. But, offered to give me a physical!! I should have know better, and should have just LIED. That would have at least gotten me antidepressants, sure, But, not sure if they would even be enough on their own. And, lying wouldn't have gotten me meds to help me get off Suboxone. And-addiction psychiatrists were booked months out for new patients.
I'm also isolating due to fear of not knowing how I'll feel physically, or if I'll even have energy to get out of bed on any given day while trying to get off this Sub. I can't go out sneezing, with watery eyes, fearing any moment I'll get entire body RLS & won't be able to remain still in front of people. I'll NEVER forget that horrible night, as long as I live, after not taking any Sub for 6 1/2 days.
I'm really just not well, and I'm isolating until I can get myself better because I don't want to be around anyone right now. I'll tell my mom when I go to rehab-just so she knows I'm alive, & where I am. I have a feeling she'll find out I'm not still at that 2nd place because she'll surely try to call me on Christmas. I'm just not getting into any of this with her. There is no point. I honestly don't even want her to visit me until I have something positive to contribute to a conversation. Not all the things I'm "going to do", etc.. But what I've done, & what I'm doing--and most importantly--until I can feel at true peace with what I'm saying & doing. Because without that-there's nothing. Right now I don't feel at peace with ANYTHING.
I've gone on a lot last night & today about my family, and how I guess what I really want is to belong to my family in a "certain way" that I never really belonged to begin with, and I want things to be different than they actually are-and it's NEVER going to happen. It is what it is. And I need to accept this once and for all-instead of continuing to try to be something I'm not so I can "belong" with them-and try to be "like them", and worrying about what they think of me. Because really- I'm sure they don't give me ANY thought at all, anyway!! It's just never going to happen. Im a grown woman, for God's sake!! Acting like a child in regard to this. At least I have a family. I know I should be grateful for that.
Although I know I need to work on this-I totally get that-I really don't see just how this in itself would cause me to be an addict. There are millions of people who have truly bad stories-not like mine-where I just "feel like I don't belong"--but people who have had truly terrible things happen to them--and they aren't addicts.
I guess chemical imbalance is also huge. I know I've always been depressed-& surely that contributed to my addiction. I'm certain of it. Chemical imbalance is the main cause of my addiction. The other stuff was a "contributing factor", too--and apparently it still is.
This all has to stop. I feel I'm old-but I realistically know I can still have a lot of good years ahead-as long as I quit smoking & get my sh*t together. It is embarrassing going to these rehabs when it's all mostly young kids, but, as I like to say--"it is what it is!"!
I was thinking, I got an email from my sister yesterday. She obviously knows nothing that's going on with me--which is good. Maybe I'll Skype her & tell her everything. I always had at least some sort of relationship with her, & miss our visits. I have to think about that more, first. Like Sam Bailey says-- I should never go with my first thought!!
Yesterday I was in my in-house safe because I had to get out the key to my bank safe deposit box to put most of the cash from my CD's in there after I cashed them out. I couldn't put it all in my checking account. I will need to qualify for Medical Assistance at some point, I'm sure. I found an array of drugs. I still haven't even gone through them all yet. But, there was a big bottle of Seroquil I used to be prescribed for sleep- (although that particular bottle I got from my drug dealer a while back. Extra strong doses.) And I found the Clonidine from when I was prescribed that by my former Suboxone doctor after he stopped prescribing Suboxone--& then became my Klonopin doctor. Now he's awaiting trial-lost his practice. (I'll send you the article, Nancy).
I will be very careful- if I even end up taking the Seroquil or Clonidine at all.
I haven't taken any Sub since last Friday-and just a tiny bit then-when I left for that 2nd rehab.
The Percs & Vikes worked (as far as "feeling them") the first two days I took them. Now- nothing. I took 6 this morning- my allotment for the entire day- & nothing. I think my tolerance is just way too high-especially after being on 8mg of Sub all those years to be taking 5mg Vikes. The strange thing is, I don't feel any physical withdrawal symptoms AT ALL--RIGHT NOW- anyway. Watery eyes even went away. But, who knows what lies ahead. That's what worries me. And, this could also be because I have been taking Vicodin-even though I may not "feel it". I even slept okay last night-without sleeping pills.
But I won't lie-- I WANT to take the Vikes, and I WANT to feel them. There just isn't any point in it. I should probably save them for withdrawal ONLY anyway. I just expected that I would feel physically horrendous withdrawal these entire two weeks- but I don't. And I'm shocked. I almost think maybe I'm "cured"!! And that I don't need to go to rehab, after all!! Just kidding. That's ridiculous. I'm still a mess- & still drinking a bit- but not too much- because I'm stuck in the house bored & depressed. Yet don't feel like cleaning or anything.
I need to be sure to also make sure I save enough "drugs" to take before I leave for rehab so that they surely find drugs in my system & not tell me that if I don't have "enough" drugs in my system, that I don't really need to be there in-patient & have my insurance refuse to pay. I've put aside 10 Vikes, & the 2 Dilaudid I found, & the benzos I have left over. I MUST get into rehab. I've worked too hard to make this happen. And I DO need it. I really don't want to take anymore Subs. I don't even know where my Subs are. My roommate hid them. Of course, I found one in my dining room in a vial just this morning. I have to hand that over, too, when he gets home.
And, when I was at bank safe deposit yesterday- I realized I have more Sub there than I thought, too. But they aren't accessible-- so I'm not worried about them. They are all going in the trash as soon as I know I'm off, & on my way home from rehab. I'll stop at the bank & collect & dispose of them. I NEVER want to go through anything like this withdrawal again- and losing a job due to taking drugs without a legal script.
My life could be EXCELLENT right now-TODAY--especially with my roommate also starting a new job. My sponsor asked me to speak at her anniversary meeting in January. My mother was even going to buy me a coat!! I probably would have even put up the tree--even if there were no gifts to go under it. Now I'm living in what I feel is hell on earth. It is my fault though, & I have no one else to blame but myself.
I still would have had to eventually get off of the Subs, though, which would have most likely caused at least some disruption in my life, at some point. But, it wouldn't have been at such a critical time as it is now, and I could have provided a decent "cover" for it. I'm just SICK over this.
And then I know there is lots of hard work ahead that I must do in order to save my life-and it's not going to happen anytime soon. I may be leaving in 2 weeks- but that will be just the very beginning.
Thanks for the link, too.
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Unread 12-18-2014, 02:53 PM   #77
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Posted twice by error. So deleted.
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Unread 12-18-2014, 05:09 PM   #78
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Me again--continuing to ramble on--
Another topic I forgot to write about before-That I think is pretty significant to my problems with myself--is that my former job used to define who I was as a person. It was a professional job--high prestige- I was highly respected simply because of my position-"alone". (Not a job like people in my family have- but still).
But, in addition to that- people did genuinely like me, because I treated everyone with the utmost respect and dignity, and always went out of my way to help them. I made good money, and was there for 8 years. Had excellent benefits & PTO.
My boss was a total di*k-- and gave me more work than even three people could have humanly handled- and he treated me incredibly NASTY for no reason at all at times--but, knowing what I know now-- no job is perfect- that's probably quite normal, & I wish I never left there.
I had tons of responsibility, and made important decisions every day--including decisions such as hiring, terminations, disciplinary actions--I lead meetings, met with many people- handled legal cases involving sexual harassment, discrimination, workers comp-- I testified in court, etc..
Point is-- I was extremely PROUD of my position, and that's what validated me as a "person", I guess. Without it-- I don't even know who I am, now. It also gave me an "identity" whenever I was around my family.
The job I had before that one was also decent. Not as good- but okay enough-& held a level of responsibility.
And going from THAT-my most recent job I was at for 8 years-To working my first job since that job at a minimum wage job in some call center where I wasn't even free to speak my own thoughts-- and sold insignificant retail products all day--was just too much for me to handle. I was bitter & angry--at myself-- & I quit. (Not the most recent job I had that I didn't even pass the test-(which paid even LESS!!) But the very first job I got back in May when I first started looking for work again). Now, I would be happy for THAT first job! It paid $12.00/hr- & had benefits. I couldn't afford to live on that-- but now that I see it's that or nothing- I'd be quite happy for it and MAKE it work, financially.
The job I got & lost at Aetna didn't pay too much more- but there was tons of room for future growth- and at least the subject matter was significant to people. Their health insurance questions are important to them. And I would have had to be trained for 16 weeks just to do the job. Plus it would have been a good company to work for. My "ideal job"? NO. Definitely not-- but it would have saved me right now-& I most definitely would have stayed, & truly appreciated it.
Funny thing-- I did what I thought was HORRENDOUS at my interview with Aetna. I answered questions very simply & didn't refer whatsoever to any management experience I had. I didn't expect to get the job- so I wasn't nervous. I acted more like I did when I interviewed for jobs when I was in my 20's-- & THATS the job I got.
I've been on TONS of interviews- I just never got hired. I have a college degree- but so does everyone & their brother applying for the jobs I was applying for- so that means absolutely nothing. I don't have a specialty degree in HR- that hurt me, badly.
But, really, what I think hurt me the most was my total lack of self confidence while interviewing. Or--being COMPLETELY overly qualified for some of the jobs I interviewed for. That sends up just as many "red flags".
Truth is-- I don't know who I am--& it obviously showed.
Now that I haven't "really" worked in two years--(any wonder I'm broke!!) I don't even know what kind of job is "me", anymore. I've lost the self confidence to do the types of things I used to do--, and I have no idea how I'm going to survive once I am ready once again to start looking for a job.
My former boss even let me change my end date to one year later so I had NO gap in my résumé when I first started looking for a job back in May. He offered to do that- I didn't ask him. But I certainly can't ask him to let me change it again! And now I have been out of the job market way too long to go for the good jobs- especially by the time I'll be ready to apply again.
Just another piece of the "puzzle" I've been pondering with all of this free time on my hands. Nothing I need to worry about today, though. I'm in no shape to even accept a phone call in regard to a job, today!!
To make matters even worse-- I just checked my e-mail & got notice I'm being considered for a professional position I applied for a while back--& they want me to take an "assessment". This could not have come at a WORSE time!! Not that I was offered or would even get the job- but I don't feel like it would be appropriate to even entertain the thought of putting off going to rehab to get my life back at this point in time. Plus the DRUGS in my system!! My God!! NO!! Who knows how long they would take to all get completely out! I'm going to press "delete" for this one. It's just so ironic that email came as soon as I finished this post.
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Unread 12-19-2014, 06:18 AM   #79
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Hi Michele, I think it's a good idea if you print off some of your posts to bring to a therapist. You're speaking freely and that could help a lot. It seems like your writing all this out is a catharsis of sorts and helping you? As far as that job assessment email, re-apply to them when you're back and feeling well. If they ask about the email - Email? What email? I don't think anyone can exude confidence when they're not feeling good about him/herself. Your main priority right now is to get there - feeling good physically and mentally. Did you skype with your sister - is she the one in Scotland you visited before?

How are you feeling, are you making sure you're at least eating something; how's your sleeping?

Nancy
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Unread 12-19-2014, 06:08 PM   #80
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Hi-
Yes-this is definitely a catharsis for me-and it's become my "routine" for the day.
At this point, unless I have a basic question-Put into a short post-I don't actually expect anyone in the "community" to give me advice, or respond. The posts are so long, and not even totally about Sub--that no one probably even has time to read them, anyway. But--if anyone does read them, and has something to say--I'm always happy to listen.
My posts are most definitely "addiction" related, though. Addiction is more than just taking drugs--and I get that now. I started to get that before, a few months ago which is why I joined NA--to learn how to change my thinking & become at "peace".
Faulty thinking, and behavior, and not knowing how to handle "life", in general--mixed with chemical imbalance, & past unresolved issues-equals "addiction".
This site is about addiction survivors--& that's what I'm trying to do. Survive from my addiction. So, although I started posting here as a "Speedy Sub Taper" thread--and it turned into a "catharsis"-it's still relevant. This is just where I'm used to "coming" to now. And I know you are here. Also, maybe someone-just one person-"as they say"- might be able to learn something from my "mistakes", and from my "experience". There are of course people who read but never post at all, too--so maybe someone IS actually reading. Who knows? But, yes-this is my "on-line journal" for now.
I guess I thought I was better, & on my way in recovery, but apparently I wasn't. But, when I was on Sub--with a LEGAL SCRIPT-I honestly didn't have any of these problems. They may have still been there-but they didn't affect me. It was my Klonopin addiction that initially made the sh*t hit the fan 2 years ago. But-since a Klonopin addiction did happen, while I was taking Subs--things still weren't obviously quite right. And they automatically insisted in detoxing me off of Sub, too, when I went to detoxes.
Last night-I was sitting with my roommate, and we were counting pills-dividing them into "rations", separating them to try to make them last, etc... & the topic was brought up that this kind of ridiculousness didn't happen once while I was on Sub.
But, Also while on a Sub--I did get into my roommates Nuvigil. He used to let me have a few at times, they give lots of energy--but once he realized it was becoming a problem for me-he hid them, but I found where he hid them. In his CAR!! So, I actually STOLE his spare set of car keys & blamed it on the "cats" knocking the keys down & losing them-& I went & took some Nuvigil pills out of the car every morning. That lasted a while--but not too long--before he caught on. Boy, was he mad. He actually stopped getting them!! (So he says, anyway!)
So, yeah, Sub did help tremendously with my depression & opiate addiction, but I still took other things. I even took Concerta & Ritalin that my son was prescribed but he never took it--so I figured I might as well take them! I'd take almost any pill if was available. I never got into weed, ecstasy-- or any hallucinogenic drugs. Would never even be tempted by such things.
But what I'm saying is--I apparently didn't do enough work on my addiction. I even used to see a therapist--faithfully-for at least 3-4 years-& thought that was "working on things"--but I guess it wasn't. I didn't start NA, though, until more recently. And at this point, NA alone-is not going to suffice. My brain is completely out of whack, & I need severe medical attention before I can begin to deal with things. I definitely still have "issues" to work through, too. Although I don't really know what there is to "work through". What I need to do is just accept things.
No-I didn't Skype my sister. Yes, she's the one who lives in Scotland who I used to go visit-& she visits here at least 1-2 times per year, also. She's always traveling somewhere. Those UK people are always on vacation!! She's the health nut, who only eats organic food, & is always preparing to run in some sort of marathon. She & my brother ran in Paris a few years back when the whole "family" met in Paris for vacation. It was really centered around the marathon. I remember worrying about taking my Subs overseas. How stupid--I had a legal script--I had no reason to worry. NOW I would, though!
My niece & nephew have never, ever tasted McDonalds, are FORBIDDEN to eat food from anywhere like that. She would be TRULY angry with me if I tried slipping my nephew a chicken McNugget!! My niece & nephew think avocados sandwiches on organic bread with sliced tomatoes and hummus are what all the kids eat!! They LOVE that stuff! They aren't even allowed to eat potato chips!! She & my brother in law are actually very good cooks, and they make excellent healthy food, & it really does make other food seem gross after eating their way for a while. But it's expensive & time consuming to eat like that all the time. But--she doesn't have to work, so she's able to do it. She helps out at the family business--but only from time to time. She used to be a top executive for Nestle--was making over 70K while she was still in her 20's--but hated "Corporate America" so much that she quit her job, waited tables for a year or two, & then went to Prague to teach English. That's where she met my brother-in-law--who is from Scotland. My stepfather didn't speak to her for almost an entire year after she quit that job at Nestle!!
I just don't know if I'm ready to talk to her about all of this, yet. I do need to at least e-mail her back, though. At the very least.
I've been eating fine. That's one thing I would actually LOVE to happen--to lose my appetite, but that hasn't happened!! I remember I couldn't eat for weeks after that place cut me off cold turkey from 8mg. I lost a lot of weight during that time.
Last night sleeping was horrendous. I even took a STRONG Seroquil before bed--but I had the restless legs pretty bad. Not as bad as I did that one night after 6-1/2 days without Sub--but bad enough that I couldn't sleep. I suffered through--& Eventually I was able to fall asleep, though. That's just the WORST feeling!! And I feel like death--mentally--when I get up in the morning--until I take Vicodin. Then I feel somewhat normal. Not "high"-- but at least ok enough, mentally. If I didn't have it--guarantee I'd still be taking Sub. Even though I don't "feel" the Vicodin-- it's quite obviously doing something.
Since my roommate is now fully aware of what's going on, & been helping me--I told him about the RLS. He says he has medicine prescribed to him specifically for RLS-it's called Mirapex, or something like that. He said to to let him know if that happens again & he'll give me some. But, I'm not sure if this is the same kind of RLS that the medication was made for. This RLS -actual "whole body" RLS- is due to drug withdrawal--it's not "regular" RLS. Do you know what I mean? So I'm wondering if it'll work. It can't hurt to try it, I suppose. I have those few Clonidine left-but they're for anxiety-not RLS. I'm saving for emergency. I don't even know if this Vicodin will last until the first. Even though I don't feel it--I take it--every few hours--because I noticed I feel bad if I don't take it.
I got a call for a temp job today--could have at least worked a few weeks, but had to turn it down because I'm in no condition to work--& with Vicodin-probably wouldn't even pass the 5 panel test. I told them I have plans & am going out of town for the holidays & won't be back until the New Year. What else could I do? There's no way I could work right now. I just ignored that other e-mail from yesterday-& when I'm ready to work again-if the position is available--I'll re-apply.
Although I picked out which rehab I want to go to, & am quite capable of getting myself in--in the past when I was new to all of this, I used a service called Sober Solutions a few times that refers & gets people all set up in rehabs. I honestly couldn't even say how I found the company! I wouldn't have to do a thing except tell him what I'm looking for, what drugs I need to get off of, & give him my insurance info one time--& sit back & let him do the rest, & then show up wherever I need to go.
I don't know how they get paid-but I know it doesn't come from me. Probably kick-backs from the facilities they refer people to, would be my guess. Last night I texted my contact from Sober Solutions-the same guy I used a few times before- & told him what's going on--& asked him if he could make it happen--if he could "guarantee"--that I get in somewhere ON the 1st. He told me he would "absolutely" get me in somewhere ON the 1st & that he's out of town now, but will call me next week. With someone like that behind me--it does give an advantage over going it on my own. I don't even want to have to wait even one or two extra days! I barely have enough Vikes to last me now. I'm going to ask him to try the place I want to go to, first, -but if that won't work--I'm sure he'll find me a good place. They only deal with good places. Certainly no homeless shelter/prison type "rehabs" who can't manage to even take proper urine samples!!
I'd really HATE to run out of Vikes & have to take ANY Sub at all--but that is a realistic possibility. Even IF that would happen, though--it would still have to be a LOT easier to get off of it than as if I had never stopped. & I could take like 1mg or something. But--I hope I don't need to do that. Those 2 dilaudids should be good enough to last an entire day--& I won't need any Vikes that day. I have them saved in my pile to take the day I leave--but, we'll see. I can't handle feeling like death!!
Oh--& that 2nd place I was at called me today to see how I was doing with my "after-care" plan, & asked me how my "outpatient appointment" went. I asked her what on earth is she talking about?! I was there less than 24 hours, got upset over smoking, said I was leaving, then apologized & asked to stay but was told I could not. She said she had NO idea. (Obviously!!)
This really scares me that these state run places are sooooo incompetent like they are. How could she NOT have known what happened? Did she just not read my file, or what? Unbelievable!!! I asked her to call the guy from a County & see if he'll fund me to go back. Not that I expect that to happen--or that I would even go back at this point knowing quality care is less than 2 weeks away--but I figured Why not try. I gave her his name & number. I have NOOO doubt whatsoever that that phone call will NEVER even be made, though!!
Not counting today--& assuming I get somewhere ON the 1st--that's only 12 more days of hell I have to suffer through. And, today is day 7 without ANY SUB at all. I feel it, too, believe me. Like I said--this would never be happening without the Vikes.
The days just go soooo slow!! I think tomorrow I'm going to do laundry & actually pack to go away so it's done in case I get too sick to do it later on. I don't know exactly where I'll be going--but even if it is FL or somewhere--I'm still just taking winter clothes. I'm going to let him know, too, that I have NOO money for any plane tickets & request somewhere local. Sometimes the places pay for the plane tickets, though. We'll see. As long as I get somewhere decent ON the 1st that has a great detox, a psychiatrist, & that will prescribe me anti-depressants & other meds, it'll be fine. I do feel more at ease having this guy handle things. He knows what to say to make sure insurance will pay, & things like that, too.
So, I'm still just waiting........
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Unread 12-19-2014, 10:55 PM   #81
MicheleJ
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Me again,
I happened to get a hold of 20 10mg Buspar pills this evening. I was told they are non-habit forming and used for anxiety, and from what I read on line--that's what it says!
I was wondering if anyone here has experience with this medication, and if it will help keep me comfortable at all during this period of time I'm coming off of Sub. Tomorrow will be 8 days off-but not "really" off since all I've done is substitute Vicodin for Subs. I was hoping that maybe if I take Buspar--I won't need to take as many Vikes.
I believe generally Buspar is supposed to "build up in the system" to be effective, so I'm wondering if taking them on an as-needed basis--since I only have 20--would be at all beneficial to me.
I know no one is authorized to give out medical advice, but, just wondering if anyone has any experience with this med in regard to being helpful with withdrawal from Subs.
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Unread 12-20-2014, 06:42 AM   #82
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Hi Michele, from what you wrote, the Suboxone helped with your opiate addiction and your depression, but you continued with the addictive behavior with other meds. That is something to bring up when you go to rehab. Maybe figure out why you transferred the addictive behavior from opiates to those other meds. That's why CBT might be helpful - you can learn to change those thoughts when they occur.

I remember you talking about your health nut sister before. Wow, it's kind of crazy that your niece and nephew never tried McDonalds. Or maybe they're not everywhere in Scotland like they are here. lol

Good idea connecting with that guy who helped you with rehabs before. I would imagine they get a 'commission' from the rehabs they set people up with. You really have to not take any bupe at all - no sense having that in your system as it might change how they treat your detox. Stick with the short-acting hydro. If it's taking the edge off of the withdrawals, it's working. You're just not getting any euphoria from it, which is good because that may make you crave it more. Clonidine has helped other with RLS - maybe try taking half of one or a whole one before bed so you can get some sleep.

As far as the Buspar, I don't know enough about it. But I do know people who it helped for depression and anxiety. Here's more information on it:
http://www.nami.org/Template.cfm?Sec...ontentID=66277

Do your laundry and pack - it will give you something else to concentrate on instead of how you feel. Will your roommate be around all weekend? That could be another distraction for you too. Less than 2 weeks now.

Nancy
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Unread 12-20-2014, 02:47 PM   #83
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Hi,
I did some laundry last night & am pretty much packed. I just have toiletries left to pack yet.
I read that Buspar link--& it said that it may take weeks before people begin to feel better. But, I took one before bed last night, & I was able to sleep very well. It made me sleepy, and I had NO restless anything! I also didn't feel as crappy as I usually do this morning when I woke up.
I didn't know Clonidine helps with RLS. Glad I know that so I can take one if it happens again. I know it helps with anxiety--which I have plenty of when I get restless like that--so I guess I see how that makes sense.
I did well on the Sub alone for a while--for years-- before I started addictive behavior with these other drugs-and it's not that I needed these other drugs because I felt bad. I felt just fine when on Sub. The BEST I've ever felt in my life. It truly did help my depression-- completely. And, I didn't actually go "looking" for the meds--they were either just "there"--like-my son's ADD meds-or in the case of the Nuvigil- it was given to me to try. I had never even heard of Nuvigil before-and have never known anyone to have it since.
Except the Klonopin. That's a bit of a different story. It was actually prescribed to me by my family doctor for sleep--for every single night--but once I was on Subs I didn't need anything to help me sleep, so I just kept filling the scripts & stashing them away--for almost 3 years. I had quite the supply. I never "enjoyed" taking them because they just simply made me sleepy-which is all they were "supposed to" do. That's why I was able to keep such a supply on hand for so long without even touching it.
But, then stress at work--and the nastiness of my boss toward me for no reason--is what caused me to start taking Klonopin to begin with. And yes--he was extremely NASTY at times--even others noticed it & asked me how on earth I could work for him. That's when I felt I would try taking just a 1/2 of a Klonopin before work each day-enough so that I wouldn't be too tired-but just enough to take the edge off & be able to make it through the workday and deal with the abuse from my boss.
Don't say I should have complained about the abuse--no-- that was NOT an option. I WAS HR--directly under my boss who was the General Manager-& the only one above him was the owner-who loves the GM, & would have not been fair or rational about any of it. My boss would have made up lies, and made me look like an idiot--& I would have been instantly fired.
They didn't always do things fairly there--there was tons of favoritism, & only all about the "bottom line". They even often "skirted" around federal laws. It was also a "men's club", so to speak. It often frustrated me as HR Manager because my boss still had ultimate say in the larger matters--which is a total conflict of interest in itself--& he treated people extremely unfairly at times. It actually caused me moral conflict sometimes, and some of the things that went on at that place--and that I had to be a part of--it just got to me too much.
One incident in particular really upset me. They fired a guy basically because his boss--who was a Department Head--just simply "didn't like him". He was one of the higher compensated hourly employees--and had a family to support. He was the absolute nicest guy you could ever meet, and he had also just been diagnosed with MS. The Department Head blatantly made up stories and exaggerated other things to substantiate cause for this guy's termination. It was all FALSE. EVERY SINGLE BIT OF IT. Everyone knew it. But, my boss had final say on that matter-and as he always did-he sided with the Department Head, and decided to fire the guy.
Then, I was expected to go & represent the company as the lead at the Unemployment Hearing. (As I did for all UC Cases). I was so upset--I remember that day-I said I'd drive, along with the Department Head guy, who rode along with me. I purposely ended up being late for that hearing-we got "stuck in traffic"--so that we could not testify because I could not in good conscious go in there & outright LIE about that particular employee who was an EXCELLENT worker, and did NOTHING wrong. He ended up winning, too.
That type of scenario happened way more than once---only I actually DID go in and testify and outright LIE ---on behalf of the "company", several times before that, though, and it was eating me up. I just now realize it's probably quite common in business. I don't know--but it upset me. Stuff like that--and the nastiness of my boss. That's what lead me to start taking Klonopin--for my nerves to get through work. And I worked a lot of hours--no 40 hour work week--I was expected to put in 50-60 hours per week. Ant trust me--I STILL couldn't even get all my work done- I was given so much to do. They just kept adding more, and more, and more-- & I had no help- no assistant, or anything. They refused to hire one--plus I also performed assistant duties for my boss- on top of everything else. I was completely miserable at that job by the end.
Taking a little bit of Klonopin every day worked out fine for a while-I made it successfully through many workdays with the help of Klonopin--of course I then became a RAGING Klonopin addict--and it became completely out of control. That was around 2 years ago to this date. December 2012 is when the shit hit the fan. Due to Klonopin--not Sub. And by the end--I was actually taking 'naps' in the supply closet during the middle of the work day!! I had a pillow and blanket stashed in there & would use my cell phone as an alarm. THAT'S how bad the Klonopin addiction got. I never got caught doing that--but I was doing it nonetheless. I just didn't care anymore. I also lost my ability to even think clearly.
Although I didn't ever actually get directly caught doing things like napping in the supply closet-- certainly my performance was quite obviously suffering, in general. I was also very often going in late, leaving early, etc.. Eventually I heard from one of the "executive management team" members that it was discussed at a closed door meeting that I was going to be fired that Friday. It was a Wednesday.
I quick shot off an FMLA letter to my boss and the owner, and said I needed FMLA and short term disability. There was nothing they could do about it. I told them I had a chronic, life threatening disease and that I was going for treatment, immediately, and I got myself into a rehab within 24 hours. In Miami--of all places. It truly was like vacation. Actually, it was the guy from Sober Solutions who made the actual arrangements. I still couldn't tell you how I even found him, though!!
THAT'S how my rehab trips all started. I learned just how easy it was to do. (As long as I had insurance!!) and I paid for my insurance through COBRA right up until June of this year.
I Collected short term disability for 12 weeks --and prevented my being fired. I also would have prevented my being fired when I returned-at least for a while--due to retaliation. But I chose to resign, and never returned.
That's also all around the same time my Sub doctor stopped prescribing Sub--and, of course I ran out of my stockpile of Klonopin that I had saved-& then after my first rehab trip I went to my Sub doctor with the reasoning that I absolutely needed HIM to prescribe me Klonopin to help me since I no longer have Sub. to take since HE stopped prescribing SUB! I told him I actually had to go to REHAB because of his no longer prescribing Sub! (Such lies!!) He was of course unaware I had enough Sub stashed away enough probably for ALL of his Sub patients combined--and then some!! -
And, as you read in the article--his prescribing practices were illegal and he eventually lost his practice.
Before he lost his practice, though, he prescribed me TONS of Klonopin. 6mg a day--90 2mg tablets per month--with 5 refills. Eventually that script didn't even last me a week. But I still also got some from my family doctor, too. And, I had also met my drug dealer somewhere during this period of time.
My Sub doc then prescribed me whatever I wanted. (except Sub!!) I LITERALLY went in with a list of all the meds I wanted prescribed one day--handed it to him--with the dose-amount, etc..& he wrote for EVERY SINGLE ONE of them, just as I had requested. They were all the meds prescribed to me during my first rehab. Except Klonopin. I lied & told him it was prescribed to me while I was there, though. I was practically writing my own scripts!!
So, that's how my "rehab vacations" all got started-back in January, 2013. And after my short term disability ran out, I resigned my position in March of 2013--thinking that was going to solve all of my problems. I just simply needed to get out of that place, I thought. (Boy, was I wrong about that solving all of my problems!!) My boss even let me collect unemployment--which shocked me. But--like I said, they don't always play by the rules there. It just so happened that that time I was one of the ones on the receiving end of unjust "favoritism". He even told me I could put I worked there a year longer than I did on my resume this past spring!! Odd how nice he was to me AFTER I resigned!! My boss & the owner could barely contain just how happy they were when I resigned, in a total phony bullshit-type of way, of course.
I continued living this lifestyle for a while. Taking Klonopin, spending as if I still had income, too!! Figuring I would just simply land a good job "when I was ready" to.
If I was in withdrawal-& needed to wait to fill a Klonopin script--or wait for my dealer to get some--I'd simply go to detox and/or rehab. They always insisted I get off Sub when I went--so of course I complied. But always took Sub, eventually, when I got back home, because it DID help me, tremendously. I just had developed a new addiction to Klonopin. And at times I was glad I was off Sub because I didn't want to have to go through getting off Sub again. Even though when it was done properly in detox-- I didn't have many problems getting off, at all. (Except for at that one place).
I always in the back of my mind feared running out of Sub & having no doctor-- even though I still to this day have enough for YEARS-if taken at small 2mg dose.I discovered the other day I have even more than I thought left. I've even been "getting rid" of some from time to time--let's just hypothetically say because I lack income right now. That bothers me, too. That I would even entertain such a thought, yet alone possibly act on it.
But, in May of this year, I decided enough was enough, & I needed to stop all this crap & get back to work. I stopped taking Klonopin & any other drugs, except for my Subs-- and got that first job at a call center within 2 weeks of starting my job search--but--it was such a drastic change compared to what I had been doing at my last job, and frankly, the job came too easily, and I didn't appreciate it at all. I just HATED it, & thought I could do better. I felt that job was way "beneath me". I thought that working there was unbearable, as well as interfering with my ability to search & interview for a "real" job--& so I quit. Without even giving notice!! I've been working crappier and crappier jobs since then. Every one seemed to get worse & worse!! And even though I landed TONS of interviews for decent positions-as I said--I never got hired for anything decent enough to actually at least somewhat live on--until Aetna. I only wish I either stayed at my original job & learned to handle the stress--or stayed at that call center job. Because now I have NOTHING.
I started going to NA because I realized I need to change my thinking & learn to be at peace, and really do want recovery.
But, obviously, I never recovered from anything, and ended up having Sub be the drug that caused me to lose the job. Well-I didn't "lose it"--I just never accepted the offer because I feared they test for Sub. But same thing. It's the incident that brought me to this current "crisis" I'm suddenly in today. I now know I have to learn to live without any drugs-- even Sub.
But, as I mentioned before--I knew I was an addict all along, but honestly did not see how drugs were actually affecting my life. Probably because I was still using up until May and not thinking clearly! Now I see how bad my addiction really is, and I'm not just looking to go on "rehab vacation". I really don't even have "time" right now to go to rehab, or the money,--I need to get a job, ASAP!! But, I honestly know I need to change or else my life is over due to addiction, and I don't think I can do it on my own. I know I can't. Especially not at first with all of the chemical imbalance in my brain. No way.
It also scared me not having insurance to even go to rehab-and being at the mercy of the "county", and those places they sent me to, because now I'm going to rehab because I really need to get my life on track, as well as get off this Sub successfully & permanently & I know I'll need meds of some sort, & antidepressants. I can't take Sub without a doctor-and can't afford a Sub doc right now. And since this "crisis" started, I'm now back to taking Klonopin, Ativan, Percocet, Vicodin, I'll be taking Dilaudids, alcohol, and Buspar. I'm a TOTAL MESS and literally hiding out in my house! Ridiculous!!
I almost also feel like I'm having "one last hurrah", in a way, too--even though there is absolutely NOTHING "fun" or enjoyable in ANY of this, and I'm not even getting high- not on Vicodin. I still love my benzos, though. They help my nerves. I just don't really have anymore--just a few that I need to save so I have drugs in my system when I get to rehab so they don't try telling me I don't need to be there. But if I could get my hands on any benzos at all today-- I'd be right there! Just being honest.
But the addictive behavior is here. It's a tragedy, really, and I'm totally miserable every waking moment. I truly am really also trying to keep myself comfortable without taking anymore Subs until I go, too, though. I don't think I could make it through the day without "something", right now, though-and I'm blowing through these Vicodin very, very quickly. And I'm not even getting high off them! What sense does this make?
I'm in active addiction right now--so none of this should come as any surprise. This has to ALL stop, for good. Not just until I get a job, or anything like that. Am I thinking about it that way--that I'll just stop until I get a job? Of course. But I can't let that happen. I need to learn how to live in true peace with myself, without using any drugs. Or else I will lose everything--if I haven't already. I'm soooo close. I see that now. I just can't believe I didn't see any of this before.
This is really the whole truth, no matter how much complete denial I may have been in while posting on here during the last 2 years. Honestly looking back-- THIS is how everything actually REALLY went down. And now I'm spending my days just writing about things because this is the best thing I have to do with my time right now!! -- & it's helping me get through each day. Although, I don't know how much more I'll have to even write about, soon!! Plus I'm sure you are completely tired of me by now!
Then maybe I'll finish binge-watching Californication on Netflix to pass the time. I got through three seasons at the very beginning of my self induced "Sub Taper". The last night I watched it was when I had that horrible episode of entire body RLS. I haven't watched anything since then. I even display addictive behavior with TV shows-- I don't just watch-- I continuously watch something until the end! I become obsessed! I did that this past year with Weeds, Breaking Bad, Nip-Tuck, Law & Order SVU, and now Californication. I don't even consider watching serial-type shows unless the whole series is available on Netflix because I don't like to wait for the "next" episode!! Same with books-- if I get into a "reading mode"-- it's ALL I do. Crazy. I really need to get back to work!!
Yes--my roommate is home this weekend. Maybe we'll watch a movie or something, later. What I SHOULD be doing is cleaning my house. I just cant get motivated to do any of that, though. I'm also feeling like I want to call my Mom & tell her I'm not really still at that place. I feel bad, lying. I just really don't want to get into too much with her, nor do I want to attend ANY holiday gatherings, if she's even going to be here, anyway. She's probably going to my brother's in the City. I'll think on it. By Christmas I'll probably have to tell her, though, because surely she will call that place to speak to me and find out I'm not even there.
Today is 8 days of no Sub, & not counting today-- only 11 more days to be at home. Assuming the Sober Solutions guy will get me somewhere on the 1st-- which I have no reason to believe he won't be able to do that. Plus he said he would. I'll go log on & double check all my insurance stuff again, today.
I think I'm out of things to talk about for now. Hope you have a great day!!
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Last edited by MicheleJ; 12-20-2014 at 03:10 PM..
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Unread 12-21-2014, 11:59 AM   #84
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Hi Michele, that's great the buspar helped. Did you sleep last night too? You could even try just a half of a clonidine if you get RLS to see if that helps since you have a limited supply. It looks like you're really uncovering a lot of things that bother you and it's good you're writing this stuff down. Especially about the addictive behavior even regarding tv shows. More things to bring up with the counselor when you go.

Did you decide when/if you'll tell your mother? Maybe just call her on xmas before she can call the place? You don't have to say where you are, just that you will be going somewhere else on the 1st.

Hopefully you watched a movie last night and finding something to pass the time today.

Nancy
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Unread 12-21-2014, 04:16 PM   #85
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Hi,
Today I just feel like total sh*t. Miserable. Completely depressed. I have anxiety, too. My eyes are watering non-stop, and I'm yawning, constantly, and I have below zero energy to do anything. Even just getting out of bed to come downstairs to my smoking room took tons of mental motivation & physical energy. I don't smoke in my house- even though I smoke. A lot, lately. And I don't even feel like smoking- which is not normal. I could barely find the energy to even give my cats their morning treats, this morning, either.
I did sleep fine- throughout the night- and tried to sleep throughout the entire day, too--I even took a Clonidine at 7am to help me sleep throughout the day-- but I woke up at noon. I really wanted to go today without taking any Vicodin, because I'm running out. Not like I'm almost out-- but I've already taken over half the amount that's supposed to last me until I leave, just to feel normal. I must not waste Clonidine anymore, either. I need to save the few I have in case I get restless legs. I really thought it would also make me feel better, too. But it didn't.
But it's just not working--not taking anything-- And even these Vikes don't seem to be helping at all, today-because I only took 2. I'm still in withdrawal. I simply can't stand it. I have to take more.
I thought about drinking for my anxiety--but the mere thought makes me want to puke. That's NOT happening.
I don't know how much longer I can stand this. I really am thinking of going back on Sub-- although I really, really don't want to do that. And today is day 9 taking no Sub at all. But I know I'd feel INSTANTLY better. I mean, I just feel like death. Minus the restless legs. If I was to get them now, too, on top of all this--I would have no doubt at all that I'd go right back on Sub instantly. Either that or shoot myself!! (No, Nancy- not literally--it's just an expression for exactly how bad I feel. You don't need to post the Suicide Hotline info ).
I have a hair appt on Tuesday afternoon-not that I can afford it- but I figure it'll be the last chance I'll have to get my hair done for probably almost 2 months--and it's already a few weeks overdue- and out of control, so I need to be able to drive myself there & sit through the appointment and carry on a normal conversation. That shouldn't even be a mere thought-- yet it seems like a completely daunting task right now. My "project" for the week. But then again, why do I need good hair right now? I'm not going to be interviewing for jobs anytime soon. I should just cancel the appointment and save the money. I'm totally dreading going, anyway.
Buspar don't seem to help, at all. I think I was just naturally sleepy the other night- because I took one last night and it didn't make me sleepy.
No matter what-- this is just going to totally suck, for sure.
I'm worried my insurance company will cancel my policy if they get inquiries before the actual effective date that I need to use it on the first effective date to go to a costly rehab. I don't even know how they can verify "future coverage", because I went on line last night, and it showed some number assigned to my account -but not the group & individual numbers I was given when I called-- and it said "nothing is currently effective"-- or something like that. Maybe providers have a special way. They MUST have a way to do this.
If that happens-- if they cancel me-I don't know what I would do. I did already pay for the first month, too. It shows up on my bank account. I really don't think I would be okay, if that happens. I know I wouldn't be ok.
I took all of my money out of the CD's-- & put most of in my safe deposit box--put some in my checking account to pay bills & insurance--because I was already denied for Medical Assistance-- (but will need Medical Assistance in the future), so I really figured that shouldn't have been an issue at this point. They said I qualified to sign up on Marketplace because I didn't qualify for Medical Assistance. I had to take those CD's out so I would have enough to pay for a couple months of insurance. My checking account was almost empty! If they go and re-check now-- I just may qualify for Medical Assistance- which would make me ineligible for my good insurance plan. I don't see why they would do that, though.
I don't understand how anyone can get off of drugs on their own. I really don't. I guess that's why most addicts actually don't end up getting off if they have to do it alone- and many die. Although I didn't take heroin-- I know I feel horrible-- I can't imagine feeling even any worse than this. This (minus restless legs) is the worst I have EVER felt from withdrawals.
Maybe this Vicodin is making things worse. My eyes didn't water this bad this when coming off of Sub alone-- unless- maybe the two- both Sub & Vicodin are some how combing together to cause this misery? I was told it takes 10 days to do a "Sub detox". So-- my Sub detox is supposed to be over by tomorrow. It just doesn't make sense how incredibly bad I feel today. And if I feel Like this every day-- No matter how hard I worked to get to this point Sub-free- I know I'll go back. Even if it means it'll be harder to find a detox that will take me. At least I won't be in misery.
I have a professional doing the legwork-- and he found me places before when I was on Sub with NO problems at all. It's the dam "County"-- they both don't know enough about addiction-or at least about Sub-- and also don't have the money for quality care. The fact that they actually couldn't find me a place-except that hospital that had NO CLUE about anything- until I told them I was mostly off Sub-- is just ridiculous, really. With insurance, finding a detox for Sub won't even be an issue. As I said before- if I had insurance- I'd be somewhere within a day--Sub or not. So-- you can probably see just how I'm rationalizing going back on Sub-- until I can get off properly. Why suffer needlessly? Makes no sense at all. As long as my insurance isn't cancelled. And really, I know there's no "logical" reason it would be-- it's even paid & I have my numbers. I'm probably just worrying needlessly.
If I was still on Sub--and not this stupid Vicodin-- I could at least even be working at a temp job right now- until I would go- because I would have passed their 5 panel test-- even with Benzos in my system.
I don't know what's going to happen. I just feel really, really horrible. And I even took more Vicodin since I started writing this-- and STILL feel horrible. Not quite as-- but not certainly not normal like I have been feeling. I think I'm done with this Vicodin. I think it's making things way worse. I'm going to try and sleep the day away after I'm done here. Maybe get some good old fashioned NYQUIL!!
I know where my a Subs are now, again, too, they aren't hidden anymore, because I needed access to them the other night. Hypothetically speaking, of course, because I lack income. Only reason they are not still hidden- because I assured I wasn't thinking of taking any. Although the reasoning why I needed them didn't go over well--AT ALL. I decided that that is IT for that crap. NO MORE. Not worth it. But I never had them re-hidden. Hell-- that's stupid anyway- because I still can drive to get more even if the ones in my house are hidden- if I really wanted to--rather-- if I really NEEDED to. It would just require a little more forethought and effort.
My roommate just came out and asked me what am I typing all day- every day. I just told him "nothing important". He would think I'd lost my mind, and tell me I'm absolutely crazy if he knew what I am "typing" all day!! He'd also tell me I should absolutely NOT be posting personal stuff on the internet. Anonymous or not-- because EVERYTHING can be traced-- if certain people are looking. Not that I have the Feds after me or anything, but still. And I bet the DEA read threads like this- even just to learn more about how addicts think. How is confidentiality protected on such websites, as this? Don't get me wrong-- I love love this AS site, and as you know-- it's actually my only outlet right now. I just think maybe I posted a bit more than is appropriate for here, and it's making me paranoid.
And God forbid anyone who knows me reads what I've been posting-- they would know it's "me" right away. I would just die. Is there any way all of my posts from this thread-- or even this entire thread- can be deleted? After I print off what I wrote, though. I don't want this to be all for nothing. I have spent a lot of time thinking, reflecting and writing- about stuff that I feel is important to be addressed for my recovery. Not everything in this thread- but enough. And once I posted each post-- I deleted the files from my tablet. Please let me know.
OH-- I almost forgot. I got into a big fight with my drug dealer last night. He's not even speaking to me. I think he cut me off for good. It's really not even worth getting into what the fight was over- but, I will anyway because life is so low and bad-- and this is a part of what's going on-- and part of where the depth of my addiction has taken me to-now as well as within the past year, and this is what I spend a good part of my day doing, lately.
Basically, I lied to him & told him I threw out all my Subs because once I told him I was done with them, he was bugging me to give them to him to sell- & we could at least share the profits. I was NOT about to do that. No way in hell. NEVER in a million years would I do something like that. Especially with this guy-- he's always totally effed up. Plus, I also convinced him that since I threw them away, I absolutely needed him to sell me Klonopins last week because I was really sick, (which that part was true), and that I had no more Sub. But, he was out & had to cut into his own personal supply-- but he did it, anyway, because he thinks we are "friends", too. I also allegedly owe him money from a while, while back-- for not even good stuff- but stuff like Seroquil. But, I figure we are "even" because I have hooked him up with similar things in the past, too-like when I gave him a big bottle of Neurotin, at no charge. He just doesn't see it that way-- and we disagree on that.
We weren't even "negotiating" a transaction, or anything, last night, just talking, and I let it slip that I still had Sub. I didn't come right out and say that, of course, but, because I was talking about how I'd no doubt end up back on them, he instantly caught on that that meant that I really didn't throw them out, like I told him I did. Plus, I told him how I was getting by with the Vikes-- that I got for free- and he was pissed because he tried to sell me some & I didn't buy from him.
Well-- that was it. He told me I was a liar, and I owed him money, I'm not "sharing" with him as he does with me, and I think we are over. But, that's good. I even blocked his number last week-- because I wanted nothing to do with him. But then I unblocked it. So, now I can just block AND delete it. There's no way this will end up good, and, with my intention of getting off of drugs for good, anyway- I don't need to be associating with him, at ALL. I would have zero interest in even associating with him if drugs weren't involved. Honestly, I was just hoping he could get me some benzos to last until I go to rehab. But, that's not going to happen. So-- now's a good a time as any to completely end this "drug-dealer/friendship" relationship that I just don't need or want in my life going forward.
The reason he considers us "friends" is because we used to take pills and go out to eat and go shopping together for a period of time, and also used to get effed up & go to a cigar bar & then go watch movies at his house. I was so effed up on a God knows what pills during one of those "events"-- we were even snorting sh*t, and I was gone for 2 days-- no one knew where I was, and I remember NOTHING about what even happened during those 2 days. I don't even know where I was. He says at his house, but still. That is DISGUSTING. That is not true "friendship", if you ask me. Even IF he gave me some free sh*t here and there. I guess I'm a bad "drug buyer/friend", too. I should have just told him NO--we are NOT selling my Subs. End of story. I just was afraid he'd cut me off if I told him that. But he did in the end, anyway.
In all my life, I never had a similar relationship as this, with anyone. And I know it wasn't healthy. But this is just another example of what addiction does, and something that I need to remember. And, honestly, the ONLY thing that bothers me about it is that I have no way to get anymore a Benzos until I leave. I don't "miss" him in any other way. What does that say about me? That I could just "use" someone for drugs like that, and even go along with a "phony" friendship to further the cause? He's just a sick and suffering addict, too, who just happens to also be a drug dealer.
I am feeling more functional, now, because I took more Vicodin. But at this rate-they will be gone by Tuesday or Wednesday. Then what? I know what. I'll be right back on Subs, anyway. Maybe I could use Sub short term--like they do in detoxes-to get people off of stuff with minimal suffering without actually "going back on" them. I wish I knew exactly how to do that. I need to figure it out. If I could do that--that would be PERFECT. But, I don't have any other proper meds they always also give at detox. That could be a problem.
I just NEVER, EVER, EVER want to feel like this again, or have to ever go through anything like this again in my life. This truly is hell on earth. I never suffered like this before because I was always able to go immediately to detox/rehab before it ever reached this point. Even when I first got on Sub--years ago- I wasn't suffering nearly this bad, I don't think.
I was reading some other threads, and I know way, way worse things can happen in life-like the death of a child, for example. Which reading that thread really upset me. I do realize that things could ALWAYS be worse.
But this is all self-induced and needless misery that I'm going through. If I just would have stayed off of everything, I'd be ok now. And I truly feel nervous about my insurance and totally helpless over my addiction, today. And I know I can't move on with my life until I get this under control, and really work a program of recovery.
I feel like I will NEVER get through this and detoxed off of drugs successfully. It's a very bad day. And I fear the days will just continue to get worse. Until I have definite confirmation I will be able to go get real help. Even then, things will take a lot of time, and people will be disappointed in me. I'm just literally completely wasting my life away right now, and damaging relationships. I should be spending time with my son, especially. And even my mother. It's the holidays, after all. Not to mention I should be working. I'm not functional at all, right now. Even though I'm getting through the day, I'm not fit to be around people. I have never felt like this before in my life. Such total misery.
I haven't decided to let my Mom know I'm home, yet. I think I'll tell her Tuesday or Wednesday of this week that my "county funding is over", but that I still feel like I need help, so I'll be going to rehab in January--and that I'm just not up to any holiday gatherings, this year. I think that's the best way to handle it--even though it's lies. That'll also provide a plausible explanation as to why, exactly, I'm going to rehab, yet AGAIN. I can't let her know what really happened and what's really been going on. Some things are best just left unsaid.
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Unread 12-22-2014, 09:37 AM   #86
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Today is another bad day. Feel awful. Didn't sleep well last night. No restless legs, though, thank God, so at least that was good. I had chills. I did completely lose my appetite, now, too. (But that's ok with me). Totally depressed, below zero energy, anxiety, watering eyes, sneezing and yawning. Diarrhea. This is all after taking 3 /5mg Vicodin, too, when I woke up, on day 10 of no Sub. In order to feel normal, I would have to take a lot more-& I just can't keep doing that because I really think the Vicodin is what's causing this. Although I really have no idea.
I try to keep telling myself I just have the flu, or something, and that it WILL eventually go away. I really don't want to go back on Subs, either--only because the whole point of ALL of this is getting off because I don't have a legal script. It's what started everything and this whole "crisis" in the first place. To do so would be absolutely STUPID. I just hope I can hold out feeling as miserable as I do. I have my electric blanket, which helps chills. And it's a gloomy day. I just feel so incredibly awful. Maybe it's good I feel like this, though, because I never felt like this before, and I know it's something I will NEVER, EVER forget going forward in my recovery.
At this point-it's a matter of suffering through Vicodin withdrawals for a few days-I guess, or going back on Sub and starting the whole detox process over--which takes a whole lot longer. I have only been taking Vicodin about a week--actually less. Today is the 6th day. Don't understand how it caused this much trouble so quickly-and without even getting high off of it. Unless I'm just so low--That I was really getting high-but it just felt "normal". But it's not allowing me to feel normal, anymore--and complicating things. Restless body would be the thing that puts me over the edge, if anything would. I don't even have restless body, but my whole body aches, that it even hurts just sitting in my chair in my smoking room & typing. No reflection or long posts today. I feel like death.
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Unread 12-22-2014, 11:59 AM   #87
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Hi Michele, I was wondering if you felt like crap yesterday because you took the clonidine in the morning and it just made you lethargic but not able to sleep. But I guess it wasn't that. Unfortunately. That's a good idea telling yourself you have the flu and wait for it to get better. You do not want to go back taking Suboxone. That'll just complicate things when you go to detox which is only 10 days away now. I don't think it mattered that you weren't getting high off of the vicodin, your body was used to you taking it and it was enough to stop the withdrawals but not get you high. Then you built up tolerance and needed more to stop the withdrawals.

Tell your roommate to hide your sub again. You really don't want to go down that road after being off it for so long now.

I hope you can get some sleep.

Nancy
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Unread 12-22-2014, 02:11 PM   #88
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Michelle,
Didn't you jumb from the subs at a pretty high dose? Like 2 mg? You are more than likely still withdrawing from the subs if you didn't taper down low and slowly. I'm still having a few lingering symptoms but they are very minor as I tapered very very low and very slowly. I tapered from 12mgs to .125 in a little over a year at my pace, no one else's. I don't think it's the Vic's doing it.... Sorry you are going through so much. For me sub has been a LIFE SAVER. I also worked an out patient program with a psychiatrist and attended group meetings twice a month for over 2 years. I really wish you could find a good sub program. I would have NEVER been able to taper off the pain pills. I tried a million times. Never worked for me, each person is different though.
I'm with Nancy on going back to the sub! I think that's not a good idea at all. I don't see a rehab telling you no with your history. That would be crazy.
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Unread 12-22-2014, 03:13 PM   #89
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Hi Nancy,
You probably won't be pleased with what I'm about to say-- but I just can't do it.
I just heard from the guy at Sober Solutions. He said that he actually can't check my insurance coverage until the 1st. But, that he works 24/7, and that it's possible for me to be somewhere on the 1st. Maybe the 2nd-because he will find somewhere for me on New Year's Day-even though I may not be able to get there that day, exactly. But maybe I will, he said, and that yes-- there definitely is a chance that will happen. I'm not going to count on it, though. I'll count on the 2nd or 3rd- at the very latest so I'm not disappointed.
I sent him my insurance plan-& he said it's a good one for rehab. And I sent him the numbers-even though he can't do anything with them, yet. I had to give him other info, too.
I told him what's been going on, & how I'm off Sub 10 days today, but been taking Vicodin, but really doubt I'd even be fit to travel anywhere if I don't at least take a minimal amount of Subs before then. (Hell, even taking a shower right now is an insurmountable task if I don't take Vicodin. It actually couldn't even be done). He told me not to even worry about it, and that he most definitely will find me a good place that will get me off of Subs, and that it will be a "smooth transition". He's done it before.
I checked the mail- and still don't have my actual "insurance card", yet, but they told me they will be sent out but may take a bit longer because of the holidays, & all the excess mail around this time of year. I have received tons of other mail from them, though. I also called myself again today to verify my insurance coverage beginning on the 1st- and that it's paid, and all is well.
I took a shit-ton of Vicodin earlier just so I could clean litter boxes and take a shower- also because I just couldn't stand feeling like death anymore. Again- I don't feel high- just normal. At this point, I don't see any logical reason in continuing to suffer like that and continuing to taking Vicodin- even though I only have enough for a few more days, anyway. It's helping when I take lots of it- yes- but it's also causing terrible withdrawals. Just as bad or worse than Sub withdrawals were. It's ridiculous. Although I know they wouldn't last as long, but still. Plus, the two together--Sub and Vicodin-May also be combining together to make things as bad as they are.
I know I need to be in withdrawals to go back on Sub- and I know for certain I will be tomorrow morning, again. I have no doubt whatsoever I'll feel like death with the same symptoms I had yesterday and today when I wake up tomorrow. I don't think the Clonidine caused me feeling worse, yesterday. I felt even worse today.
I'm going to just do as I've done before- take the smallest dose possible, and even skip days until I go. I'm going to take 2mg. I know it's incredibly stupid after 10 days off- but I'm hopeful during my own "detoxes" that I still at least got a good amount out of my system, and by taking only the bare minimum that it'll still make it a lot easier once I get to detox/rehab. A decent place- where they actually know what they're doing, too.
Maybe I can even even the slightest bit "salvage" Christmas. At least see my son & my mom for a short visit, at some point-- even if not on Christmas Day. I really want to, if at all possible. If not, of course I understand-- if they have other plans.
This whole "self induced crisis" has to stop. I know I'm going to do what I need to do, so why suffer needlessly until then? Another 10-11 days, at the very least-- when I don't have to? Especially since I can't get any benzos to help. I looked up the "Thomas Recipe"-- and if I could get my hands on some Valium I'd try it, but that'll never happen. I know that would probably work, too. That's obviously the "main ingredient". Who am I kidding- I'd probably take all the Valium before I'm supposed to. But it's a moot point, anyway.
I just want to feel as normal as possible so I can function until I go. Even if I just sit and binge-watch Netflix everyday until then--feeling normal- It'll be better than this craziness.
Although a huge setback in my detox off Sub, I'm a "crazy person" right now, and totally sick. And even though I'm only taking Vicodin to feel normal, I feel like I'm in total active addiction, taking all of this Vicodin, but I don't need to be. Of course Vicodin or not- I was still in active addiction because of the drinking and benzos, too- which I would definitely still take if I could get. Drinking, however, I'm done with. It's disgusting, and the mere thought of it makes me totally sick.
I looked at my posts- to print off- and they are off the wall--since I started taking all of this Vicodin. All true-- but progressively off the wall, nonetheless. At least I have all that stuff in writing, which will be helpful, too.
I'm glad all this happened though, because I'll NEVER forget it. And NEVER let this happen again. I'm certain my experiences from the past month will help me going forward. And somehow they are actually what allowed me to even get insurance, to proceed, to begin with. So, it wasn't all for nothing, in the end. Perhaps it worked out just the way it was "supposed to".
This whole thing caused me to get back into active addiction, too, after months of not doing that. Even if I wasn't "recovered"- I was still not taking anything but my Subs-- and living normally, working, applying for jobs and going to NA- and working on recovery.
If I can feel normal, and not "Vicodin normal", and not feel like death, maybe I can even go to my NA Meetings at night, at least to get out of the house-- even though I know I'm still technically "using"- according to them- and even though I had a relapse.
So, that is my plan. I knew it was coming, of course, but I've now completely rationalized it, and to do anything else seems totally "irrational" to me right now. This is what Sub is for. I don't feel in the slightest bit I'd even be "abusing" it--AT ALL. Like I said-- stupid after 10 days off? Yes. Absolutely. Totally counterproductive. But I don't think I'll make it without. Not 10-12 more days. Even if I had it re- hidden, as sick as I've been without taking Vicodin- I'm absolutely certain my roommate would give it to me. He can see how bad I look when I wake up- and at night hours after I stop taking Vicodin. We talked about it last night. And I won't be taking much, at all. 2mg every few days. That's it. And I'm sure that will help me tremendously. After hearing from that guy that it's not an issue, I guess that's what I was waiting for, subconsciously- after all that crap I went through with the County, and it being such a huge issue with them.
I'll sleep on it-- & think about it. But I'm pretty sure my mind is made up. I'll try to hold out as long as I can, though.
The other thing I could do is finish the Vicodin, & those Dilaudid- and suffer at night and in the mornings--still knowing I'll get relief, soon enough, in order to prolong going back on Sub for a few more days-- to have more "Sub detox" time, and end up taking less Sub, overall, before I leave. But not sure what the point of that would be- since I won't be taking much to begin with. Just enough to stop the withdrawals & cravings, & feel normal.
Telling myself I have the "flu"-- and not taking any "flu medicine", which is right here-- isn't working out, at all. I guess I'm just to weak of a person for that. I can't handle suffering. I truly couldn't even get out of bed.
The ONLY reason I DEFINITELY wouldn't take it, and suffer through-- God knows how-- is if I was still worried about my insurance. But I'm not anymore since I spoke to them again today. Plus it's even paid.
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Unread 12-22-2014, 04:08 PM   #90
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You do know how to induce sub properly right? I would hate for you to get precipated withdrawals and end up 20 times worse than you feel now. Please be at a 26 on the paws sheet before you induce yourself with subs. That means about 24 to 48 hours with no pain pills or the dillatuin depending how fast you metabolize stuff. Have you did this before? It really can be super dangerous if you don't know what you are doing. Benzos and subs can kill you also....
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Unread 12-22-2014, 04:14 PM   #91
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Hi Runner,
This all started about a month ago, to the day. I got myself totally worked up because I've been taking leftover Subs from my former Sub doc- who no longer prescribes- so with no legal script-and I fear pre-employment drug testing, because a lot of companies do test for it now, which they didn't used to. I had no idea about that, though. I was sure a job I had just gotten tested for it. I caused what turned into a "self-induced crisis", I believe.
I was taking 2mg a day. Possibly up to 4mg, some days. I still have the orange tablets & broke by hand- so never probably "exact".
After this started a month ago, I was going to do a taper. But, then somehow tried to jump off at 2mg. I lasted 6-1/2 days- then restless body got me. I took 2mg. But, still kept skipping days. Then I got into some county funded rehabs, and it was a huge issue for them to find me a place that would detox me off Subs. I continued to take as little as possible. Not sure exactly how much- but not a lot-- & skipped many, many days. But, I also know I did take 8mg 2 days in a row at some point within the past month. It's been sporadic.
But, it's been 10 days off, today. The last dose I took before that was a "sliver", and I've been taking the Vicodin the past 6 days-- and feel like total death without tons of Vicodin, now. Truly believe it's making things worse. You are probably right-- the Subs are causing the withdrawal, too-- and the Vicodin is only making things even worse. That's exactly what I was thinking, too.
Either way- I have insurance now, effective on Jan. 1st, and definitely going to detox & rehab. And since I'm doing that, at someplace that's experienced in handling Sub detox-- which I have also done before, successfully- gotten off at a detox--I just don't see the sense in suffering until then-- when I'll actually be able to go, and know I'm going in 10-12 days, max. But 10-12 days is a long time to suffer.
I don't plan on taking anymore than like 2mg-- and not even every day. I just can't take feeling like this, especially knowing I have what I need to feel relief, and that I'll be going somewhere that'll be able to get me off successfully, and relatively painless. Just doesn't make sense, to me, at all, at this point.
Hopefully my own "detoxes" will at least somehow help, in the long run.
I know Sub is a lifesaver. I've been on it for the most part for 5 years. But then got a terrible Klonopin addiction 2/12 years ago-- and I also saw a therapist for years while on Sub. So, I still obviously have work to do on my recovery. Before this, I went months only taking Subs, & going to NA-and thought I was doing well. But taking Sub without a legal script is no longer an option.
I still have lots of Subs left-- but can't take them without a Sub doc-- & the only ones around here are cash only-- VERY, VERY costly. Plus the cost of the script. I'm not working right now. I'm using my savings to buy insurance to go to detox and rehab, because it has to be done. I can NOT do this on my own. I tried, and failed, miserably. I honestly don't know what I'd do if I couldn't go.
The insurance I got is excellent for detox & rehab-- but everything else is costly. I had to get a zero deductible plan, so I wouldn't have to pay thousands up front to go- because I just don't have it. All the other co-pays and prescriptions on the plan are high, though.
I really don't want to take more Sub, no. But I can't handle feeling like death. Needlessly.
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Unread 12-22-2014, 04:20 PM   #92
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No, I've never "induced" myself before. When I first went on 5 years ago, a doctor did it. Then, I started taking Subs again after being on nothing at all, but never "induced" myself after taking opiates, no.
I thought I only have to be exhibiting severe withdrawal symptoms during "induction", like I've been experiencing every morning. Is that not so?
I haven't taken benzos in a week. Vicodin & Dilaudid- which I haven't even taken the Dilaudid-and certainly don't have to- are both short acting. I thought that made a difference, too-- because of how quickly I get withdrawal symptoms after stopping taking any.
Oh my a God!! Now I'm terrified about doing this. And I don't see how I'll survive without Sub! I'll never make it.
Where can I find the paws sheet?
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Unread 12-22-2014, 05:07 PM   #93
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Hi Michele, you need to be in mild to moderate withdrawals, but the longer you can wait the better, like up to a 26 like Runner mentioned. Especially because of your anxiety, it could present itself as part of WDs and if you take the bupe too early, it'll only make it worse.

The COWS is on page 2 of this sheet: http://www.naabt.org/documents/NAABT_PrecipWD.pdf

That's a good idea of only taking 2mg. That will likely be enough after being off for so long. But if you could start at 1mg, wait an hour or so, see how you feel and then take the other 1mg, that would be better. Just in case you only need 1mg.

How long were you taking benzos for and was it every day? I'm sorry I don't remember - but you also have to make sure that isn't playing a role in how you're feeling too.

You have to try to calm down about it too. It will work out, but if you're in a panic, like I mentioned, that could make you think you're in worse WDs than you really are.

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Unread 12-22-2014, 05:17 PM   #94
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Michelle,
There is a bup form on drugs.com. I would post there about what you are going to do, there are lots of folks that can help. Google COWS, meant cows instead of paws. And no you have to be in full blown withdrawl, normally at the least 24 hours opiate free or it can get 1000 more times uglier. Please research this it's no joke. I would hate to see you even sicker.
http://www.naabt.org/faq_answers.cfm?ID=70

Here's a link on it.
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Unread 12-22-2014, 05:19 PM   #95
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Lol Nancy we posted at the same time....
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Unread 12-22-2014, 05:29 PM   #96
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Hi Nancy,
Yeah, I found it- I thought it may be called "COWS" Scale- so I looked that up. I got the same exact one you gave me.
I know I'll definitely, at bare minimum, be in the range of 5-24-- I know at very least I'll score in the "mild" stage. I never measured my pulse or checked my pupils. I will, though. But I don't even know what normal pupil size is. I also didn't include anxiety- because I can't be objective enough about that.
I scored a 6, conservatively, based on my symptoms of the past 2 days- without those 3 components of pupils, pulse and anxiety. So I should be good--according to what I read, that's all that's needed. It would be BETTER to be 26- but it says 5-6 is "sufficient".
Wow-- and I think THAT is unbearable? I couldn't even BEGIN to imagine being up in the 25-36 range. That must cause people to become LITERALLY suicidal. I most definitely wasn't even that bad when the doctor induced me years ago. This is such a horrible thing- drug withdrawal.
It says for short acting opiates- like Vicodin- patients must wait 12-24 hours before induction. I have been going 12 hours without taking any Vicodin- which is why I end up feeling like death (to me) in the morning, although I see now how much worse it could be. So, I assume that would be okay. I'll hold off a few extra hours, though- just to be safe. I'll wait 16 hours and score higher. No- I'm going to wait 24 hours. Why risk it? I want to get this "induction" over with ASAP, though, while remaining calm. Also, I'll try 1mg, instead of 2mg. The less, the better.
I last took 20 Ativan, last week, over the span of 2-3 days, ending last Monday. The week before I took 30 some Klonopin.
Thank you SO MUCH for alerting/reminding me about this, Runner!! And thank you, Nancy, of course.
I'll check out that other site, too, Runner. I don't usually look at any other sites but this one, but, I will. Thanks again.
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Unread 12-22-2014, 06:17 PM   #97
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I'm SOOO angry with myself for taking this stupid Vicodin! I truly thought this "plan" of just taking it until I left for rehab, would work. I should have known it wouldn't, and would only make things way, way worse. I honestly thought I could stay off of Sub, too.
This is just horrendous-- this whole entire thing. I can NEVER, EVER go through anything like this again. EVER. It is the absolute WORST thing ever!
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Unread 12-23-2014, 07:01 AM   #98
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Too funny we posted the same thing at the same time Runner!

Michele, how are you this morning? Let us know when you can.

Nancy
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Unread 12-23-2014, 12:55 PM   #99
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Hi,
Nancy, first of all, I really want to thank you so incredibly much for all of your support, and for being here for me--every, single day during this absolute lowest point in my life. I don't know what I'd do without you, right now. You are an incredibly kind and giving person. Please know how much you are truly appreciated.
I'm not well-as usual. But then again, I won't be until I'm on my way to detox and rehab. I'm totally fearing this "Sub induction", now, which I never quite thought of that way, but, that's really what it is. Thanks to Runner for pointing that out and possibly saving me tons MORE misery on top of all the misery I'm already in.
Knowing I'm going to have to suffer for 16-24 hours now, anyway, no matter what--and worrying about "proper Sub induction" and precipitated withdrawals is causing me extreme, extreme anxiety. Even though I rationalized that "technically" I only need to score a 5. Plus I noticed my anxiety is through the roof in general now, too--worrying about all kinds of things I have zero control over--but I keep thinking if certain things were to happen now--while I'm like this--that I don't know how I'd get through them--like if my roommate has a heart attack and dies--and things like that.
Last night-I decided I wanted to sleep-my mind was racing so much--so I took some Vicodin and 3 Buspar-and was able to do. Usually I just suffer through the nights. But I really only have enough left for 1-2 days, now-before the suffering begins. I think I have closer to one day's worth left. I haven't counted them. I honestly don't even count how many I take, either.
Then I thought that instead of going back on Subs, I would "taper" myself off of the Vicodin instead. So, I'm kinda trying that now. I do have those 5 Benzos left-too-which could be helpful in getting off of this Vicodin--but--I'm not sure they would be enough, or that I'd even be able to take them properly. Or--if they are the right ones. Plus I'm pretty sure I'd still be super depressed even if I could minimize physical withdrawal symptoms. (Where I got my medical license from--I don't know?)
Then of course I felt bad this morning--although not nearly as bad as I've been--because there were far less hours of not taking any Vicodin. So--I'm right back at it!!
Last night-one of my "male friends" with 18 years clean from NA texted me to see how I am doing because he hasn't seen me in a while. I told him what's been going on. He was nice at first, then nasty--and he was actually hitting on me throughout the entire 2 hour conversation.
He works for the County-in a different division completely from the Drug & Alcohol Dept--he works in Children & Youth, but he still knows everyone-& he told me to call the same place I already went through--and then I had to tell him what happened with THAT-& that I already DID go through them, but I ended up--for all practical purposes-getting "kicked out". He didn't even LISTEN, obviously, to what happened at that first place-how they messed up the first 3 urine samples & then said the 4th one had no drugs-which was absolutely impossible-& that they weren't even going to give me detox. And of course I was a total idiot at the 2nd place--even IF I tried to make it right.
So then he told me that I just need to "lose everything"-and until that happens I will never "surrender"--and then told me he "doesn't discuss treatment with people who are high". He's out of his mind. I mean, I know he was trying to help-I think-but he's WRONG. WAY wrong. But, he too now thinks I'm scum. And although I'm certain this Vicodin is ******g with my thinking--I am not high.
These people in NA-I wonder about them sometimes. The fact that he was blatantly hitting on me--at a time like this--I mean--he was REALLY, REALLY hitting on me. Completely inappropriate. And then to say such harsh things, like that. Just makes me feel worse. And--that I was good enough to text & hit on--until he found out about what happened with the County-where he works. And I didn't even mention how truly bad the 1st place they sent me was-or say anything negative at all about the County. -But because that happened-now he wants nothing to do with me-kind of pisses me off, even though I don't have any interest in him that way. He hit on me before, too--& then I started ignoring him when he did that. I guess maybe even though he has 18 years clean-the fact alone that he was hitting on me--at a time like this, especially--speaks volumes of where his "recovery" is at. I shouldn't have even talked (texted) with him to begin with. I should have ignored him. Now I bet he'll look up my file in the system. He probably has access to it, somehow-and see that is states I'm "Resistant to Treatment"!
My God! Every day it seems like something else! And I'm not even leaving my house! A new fight--both with my drug dealer & now a fellow NA Member!! I must be REALLY, REALLY bad--Not suitable for either of the 2 opposite ends of the spectrum. I must be even worse than I even think I am. I'm going to ignore everyone-totally-from now on, until this situation is over. Although-I must say-neither of these were either "healthy" or "significant" relationships" to begin with, but STILL! I'm not able to even maintain casual relationships with people right now. It's the mere point of it.
Then-I received a voicemail message that leads me to believe I do qualify for Medical Assistance. The are sending me a "packet" in the mail that I'm supposed to fill out immediately and send back, once I receive it. I went to the website they mentioned, and it clearly states that if someone is sent one of these "packets", that they most definitely can sign up. They do offer private insurance there, too, but horrible insurance-and only 4 plans to even choose from.
But, I also got a letter in the mail that they needed my bank statements-which I already provided to them-as well as my car insurance info-which I wasn't asked for, before. So I'm really confused. But, since I have private insurance that I desperately need, effective next week, I'm not going to delve into it any further. With the government-this would all take weeks to play out, anyway, I'm sure. The woman at the D&A place told me flat out that I was denied for Medical Assistance. I have that in writing, from her, too.
Furthermore, I saw a missed call from my mother yesterday. So, she clearly knows I'm not at that place anymore, or else she wouldn't be calling me. So now I'm wondering if I should call her, or not. Considering my track record lately, I'm actually thinking of not calling her and just letting everything go until next week. I'm going to probably be deathly ill on Christmas Day, anyway. God only knows what that place told her--even with HIPAA laws-because I put her name down as someone who could call about me. I just don't want her to worry about me.
I'm at a loss-dreading everything. Regretting everything. Fearing everything. Worrying about my paid for insurance again, too-with the government mixed up in my life now. What if they cancel it if they find out I qualify for Medical Assistance? IF I qualify for Medical Assistance, even though I was told I don't. I don't know whether or not it's even illegal for someone who qualifies for Medical Assistance to buy insurance on the Market or not, anyway. What if someone had someone else paying for private insurance for them? How could that be illegal?
But, with the holidays, and the weekend, not counting today, there are really only approximately 4 whole business days until my insurance goes into effect. Not much time for the government to get anything done. I just want this all to be over with so I can move on with my life. I am NEVER, EVER taking drugs again. EVER. Nothing like this has ever happened to me before, and I could NEVER handle something like this again--if I even ever actually get through it now. I'm concerned I just may not end up getting through it.
I really need to suck it up & get back on Sub so at least I can think clearly and have less anxiety. It'll be less than a week that I'll be back on it-after almost 2 full weeks off, when I actually do get back on it. That can't be nearly as hard to get off of. But I would never make it through the next week without it. No way. I really think I could become seriously suicidal due to how completely depressed I would knowingly be-even if I had no physical withdrawal symptoms-which wouldn't be likely, either, anyway. I don't need to end up locked up in the psych ward on top of everything else when I'm supposed to be going to detox & rehab in 8-10 days. This is true misery like I have never experienced before.
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Unread 12-23-2014, 02:14 PM   #100
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Hi MicheleJ, Yes, I do read your posts and am so sorry for your misery. It seems to me that if you are planning to go back on suboxone then you really should just not take anymore of the other drugs and get on with the induction. You will only feel miserable for a little while waiting to take the suboxone, and you know that once you do you will feel so much better. Your brain is so confused now with all the mixtures of medications that it sounds pretty dangerous-and besides they are not helping you feel better. Anyway, just wanted to pop in and hope that you will get settled and comfortable soon. There is no need to worry about precipitated withdrawals as long as you wait long enough and rank high on the cows list. You are so miserable and I think the suboxone would give you some stability. Just my opinion as I am no medical person but I do worry about how you are doing. Best wishes,

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