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Unread 05-26-2007, 10:12 AM   #1
Dee11
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Default Scared to Start Sub

Hi Everyone,

I am new to this forum and have been reading it for days.

I finally took the steps to get myself clean after being on pain meds for almost 8 years, due to being hit by a car and resulting back pain, numberous surgeries, ect. I got so tired of chasing drugs, the costs, the waiting for the delivery man. ect. After much thought and a call to a drug hotline I learned about Sub. Was able to get a doctors appointment the very next day (that supprised me!)I was elated at the prospect of a new drug free life.
I unfortunatly had a very bad experience with my first Doc visit. The place was dirty, smelled and the doc in my opinion didn't care at all about me. I brought all my medical records (didn't even look at them)
He spent about 10 minutes with me, wrote a script for SUB 8 mg/2 x a day. No "induction" He treated me like any "junkie" which is exactly what I was afraid of. I cried all the way back to work.

I called the Sub hotline and asked questions.

Doc.'s final statement to me was "if you don't come back in a month, I assume you failed" So CLEARLY I know I need to find a new doctor.
But I want to go ahead and start the Sub anyway.
I was taking Vicoden 10/500, 8-10X a day.

I told my hubby about all this the night before I went to the Doctor (he was incredibly supportive) next call was to my mom (that was a little harder) then called my sister and her husband. My brother in law works in the pharmacudical industry and went on-line gave me the dosing info (Doc never clearly stated HOW I was supposed to take these 2 Subs a day) They have all been WONDERFUL.
So the plan was, since I usually took my last dose at about 3:00 PM of the Vics. Was to wake up today and NOT take my normal 5 pills in the AM (the Pain in the morning is the worst)and that way the withdrawl would come by noon.
Well I woke up and took the Vics as I didn't get the Sub RX filled yet (Hubby said he would fill it for me this morning)
Now I am disappointed in myself that I took the Vics, I know what it is, I am really scared of the Withdrawl part of this process. I have told myself, i won't take anymore today, so the W/D should start late this afternoon. I wanted to start this process and have the long weekend to adjust to it, before returning to work on Tuesday, I have new job and cannot "call-out"
I am not really sure how much I am supposed to be in W/D before starting. I prefer to start it when the W/D is "mild"
But the truth is I am scared to start the Sub all together, i think for fear it won't work and the fact that I found probably the worst participating doctor in the program.
Can anyone give me the encouragement to take this giant step?

I love reading all you inspiring stories, and am so glad I found this message board.

Dee11
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Unread 05-26-2007, 11:11 AM   #2
bam55
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Welcome Dee,you have made a great decision to use sub as a tool in improving your life.You will soon agree it is one of the best decisions of your life. If you have been doing a lot of reading here you already know that getting stabalized and determining the correct dose can be a little tricky and varies for everyone but usually it goes pretty smooth.Once stable and on the right dose you will feel great. Dont be overly concerned with having to endure painfull withdrawls.Mild to moderate is all that is needed to start and relief is usually very rapid once you take the sub.
Hang around and you will recieve tons of support and advise.
This will be a memorable Memorial day for you,next year at this time you will remember it fondly.
Bill
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Unread 05-26-2007, 02:27 PM   #3
flier1
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Dee
When I started 6 months ago I was 14 hrs from taking my last dose of Percocets and I took an 8mgs when I got there and about an hour later took another 8mgs and felt like I felt before I even touched a percocet before, but if you can you may not need that high of a dose I wask taking 30-40 10/325 per day but maybe after you are in WD'S maybe take 2mgs wait about an hour then 2 more and so on you jsut want to take the WD'S amd cravings away, but IMHO less is more but it has been a life saver for me I wish you the best and keep us updated

Helen
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Unread 05-26-2007, 03:44 PM   #4
twhit58
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DEE,
I am now on day 28-YEAH! Your story sounds just like mine.I was taking about 8-10 vicodins (10mgs.) a day for at least ten years-tried many times to stop,nothing worked for me,I went into rehab at least 2 times,tried by myself the whole thing.I have cervical disc problems and that is what started this nightmare.In Janurary I had to have surgery and the problem just got worse-Anywho---I probably shouldn't tell this but I'm going to.I,like you,was so afraid of the withdrawal that I just couldn't take the sub,I have a great doc that was very patient with me.I finally decided to go in the office and take my first dose.As we all know lying is part of this nightmare.I took 2 vicodin(10 mgs about 7 in the morning because I couldn't bring myself to start w/d's.I went to the doc about 10am,she ask if I was in w/ds and I said "kind of"(lying,of course),she took my urine sample and for some reason it came back okay??? By the way,that was the last time I have lied about anything.I took the first dose and was scared to death it would put me in instant w/ds because that's what the literature says-that if you are not in w/ds the sub will make that happen.It didn't,after an hour in the docs office I felt like a new person,I can't describe it,it was like I was clear and the whole world was clear again.I couldn't believe it.I was to the point that I thought, this is my life,sooner or later I'm going to die from vicodin,how sad. I am on day 28 (had to say it again) and for the first time in 10 yrs. I feel like myself,I'm not worried all the time wondering where I'm going to get the next script--As far as I'm concerned,it's over- done with!! I can't lie and say everyday has been like disney world but I don't know anyone who has disney days everyday.Please try not to be afraid,I promise you will be so grateful that there is a way out of vicodin hell.Take care and I will be thinking about you.
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Unread 05-26-2007, 05:44 PM   #5
pedenter1
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Dee11,

As the saying goes - just do it! But, I would start at a very low dose of Sub, use the W/D scale to check how far into W/Ds you are before starting - it's a shame your doctor was such a jerk - you should have been monitored in his office during this stage (but doesn't sound like anyplace I'd want to spend much time so maybe it's for the best) - you don't have to be horribly sick - trust me - I was taking in the range of 50 5mg. Percs a day, plus 60 mg. of MSContin (long acting morphine sulfate). I took my last MSContin about 3 days before my induction and (while I was waiting to see my doctor for my induction had been slowly reducing the amount of meds I was taking - but was still way, way up there) - took my last 3 Percs at 4 pm. the Sunday before my induction on Monday morning (first thing - I like you was terrified of W/D's) - I got there at 8a.m. and actually felt fine - had to come back at 11 and I still didn't feel that bad, but it was enough for the doctor to start me - and he started me with 4 mg. of Sub, I felt okay, then after about 45 mins. he gave me the other 4mg., at that point I started to not feel too good - maybe just sitting there for 3 hours or so was getting to me - I was freezing and just wanted to go home and lie down - he sent me home with instructions to take another 8 mgs. that night and come see him the next morning. He also gave me a script for 3 8mgs. Suboxone, luckily, cause the next morning I woke up with a world class Migraine (something I have been dealing with for many years - nothing to do with the Sub) - so I called and he told me to stay home and just take the medication on my own - which I did 4mg. at a time. The full 8mg. at the beginning made me feel kind of hot and wosey and flushed. Just based on *my* original dosage and yours, I would started with a very low dose - you can always take more. But trust me - it will be the BEST thing you'll have ever done for yourself!

I know there's a link for the withdrawal scale - I also seem to lose my message when I try to link so I'll leave you here and try and go find it and post it after. Good luck and like everyone else here - we're with you - and let us know how it goes. Enjoy your new life - I'm enjoying the heck out of mine and it's only been just shy of 2 months for me.

Pat
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Unread 05-26-2007, 05:48 PM   #6
pedenter1
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Link to withdrawal scale

http://www.naabt.org/documents/NAABT_PrecipWD.pdf

You should be able to click on this and view and print with Adobe Acrobat.

Cheers,

Pat
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Unread 05-26-2007, 06:27 PM   #7
Dee11
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HI Everyone,

Thank you for responding, it is now 2:30, last vic dose was at 6:00 this AM. I excersized this morning and that made me feel better, just about now I am begining to feel a little W/D creeping up.(sweating, runny nose)
I will wait as long as I can. I think I am only going to start with 4 MG, and go to 8 if needed. I am afraid he started me to high. It seems alot of poeple have to adjust themselves based upon how they feel.
I think I am going to try and wait until 6:00 PM, that way it will have been 12 hours since last dose. Think that is okay?
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Unread 05-26-2007, 06:29 PM   #8
Suture
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Dee11,
looks like you already have some great advice here and congratulations for taking the first step. Vicodin is a fast acting opioid, and that's good, it means you won't have to wait all that long for the withdrawal to start (people on methadone may have to wait days) One thing to be cautious of is that it is easy to mistake anxiety for withdrawal since its one of the symptoms but it can happen just from the prospect of starting a new treatment. The link pedenter gave you will give you a way to be certain it is withdrawal you are feeling. Best of luck.
S-
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Unread 05-26-2007, 06:36 PM   #9
Dee11
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HI Everyone,

Thank you for responding, it is now 2:30, last vic dose was at 6:00 this AM. I excersized this morning and that made me feel better, just about now I am begining to feel a little W/D creeping up.(sweating, runny nose)
I will wait as long as I can. I think I am only going to start with 4 MG, and go to 8 if needed. I am afraid he started me to high. It seems alot of poeple have to adjust themselves based upon how they feel.
I think I am going to try and wait until 6:00 PM, that way it will have been 12 hours since last dose. Think that is okay?
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Unread 05-27-2007, 04:12 AM   #10
RemissionRocks
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i started at 4mgs. that would be your best bet. just make sure you're in full withdrawal. i dont think you will have a problem with precipitated withdrawals as long as you're feeling sick when u go in.
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Unread 05-27-2007, 04:12 AM   #11
RemissionRocks
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i started at 4mgs. that would be your best bet. just make sure you're in full withdrawal. i dont think you will have a problem with precipitated withdrawals as long as you're feeling sick when u go in.
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Unread 05-27-2007, 12:52 PM   #12
bdog
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Don't feel lonely with the crack pot doctor, a number of us have had similar experiences.As long as you are in wds IMO 36-48 hrs you will do fine.Short acting opiates are a little better to transfer to suboxone than long acting.Try and find a new doctor as soon as possible.It took me a couple months,but I am now very happy with the doctor I now have and everything in my life is grand.Suboxone gave me a life worth living and as you read more and more of the success stories on this forum you will see that I'm not alone.Good luck in your recovery, you will do just fine.Welcome to NAABT!!!
Peace..Bdog
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Unread 05-27-2007, 12:52 PM   #13
bdog
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Don't feel lonely with the crack pot doctor, a number of us have had similar experiences.As long as you are in wds IMO 36-48 hrs you will do fine.Short acting opiates are a little better to transfer to suboxone than long acting.Try and find a new doctor as soon as possible.It took me a couple months,but I am now very happy with the doctor I now have and everything in my life is grand.Suboxone gave me a life worth living and as you read more and more of the success stories on this forum you will see that I'm not alone.Good luck in your recovery, you will do just fine.Welcome to NAABT!!!
Peace..Bdog
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Unread 05-27-2007, 01:38 PM   #14
CTCheryl
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Hi Dee, and Welcome to NAABT!

Vics were also one of my DOC's and I stopped taking them at 5PM on a Thursday and by 4AM during that night I took my first 8mg of Suboxone. I was OK enough to get up and go to work on Friday and took another 16mgs during the day. My Sub doctor starts us off on a higher dose to begin with and then lowers us after the first week.

I feel badly for what you are going through with your doctor but at least you've formed a back up plan and support.

Oh, one more thought, the exercise is great and will be a huge benefit as you progress in your treatment. I just wanted to tell you I remember MattV one of our members that is a umpire and the first few days when he was running up and down the football field noticed the hard physical activity brought on symptoms. Once he dosed he was fine.

Keep in touch,
Cheryl
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Unread 05-27-2007, 01:38 PM   #15
CTCheryl
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Hi Dee, and Welcome to NAABT!

Vics were also one of my DOC's and I stopped taking them at 5PM on a Thursday and by 4AM during that night I took my first 8mg of Suboxone. I was OK enough to get up and go to work on Friday and took another 16mgs during the day. My Sub doctor starts us off on a higher dose to begin with and then lowers us after the first week.

I feel badly for what you are going through with your doctor but at least you've formed a back up plan and support.

Oh, one more thought, the exercise is great and will be a huge benefit as you progress in your treatment. I just wanted to tell you I remember MattV one of our members that is a umpire and the first few days when he was running up and down the football field noticed the hard physical activity brought on symptoms. Once he dosed he was fine.

Keep in touch,
Cheryl
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Unread 05-30-2007, 03:47 PM   #16
flier1
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Dee
How are you doing today? Hopefully you are off and feeling great, I know that is how I felt on my first day of Sub. LOL....Please keep us updated , and in the meantime I would try to find a different Dr. one that you feel really comfortable with.

Helen
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Unread 05-30-2007, 11:03 PM   #17
Dee11
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Hi everyone,
Thank you for the kind words of support. I started the Sub this past Saturday evening. I took 2 Mg, then an hour later took another 2. I felt really good!
Sunday I again took 2 mgs at a time, I think it was 8 total that i took Sunday. Everything was going fine, though yesterday I got a really bad dizzy spell, that lasted about 15 min. I was not sure if that was because I took to much, or not enough. Doc perscribed 16 mgs per day. I have not taken that much at this point. Seem to be steady at 10.
My question is this, I have not really been taking them on any schedule. Though I have been writing down, when and how much.
When I got up today I took 4 mgs then 1 mg an hour later then 2 Mgs twice today.
Is it better to take in smaller increments? Because I have been pretty much dosing small amounts throught the day.
I was afraid that if i took them at a "scheduled" time I would have a hard time breaking the schedule when it was time to ween off. Guess I should not be to concerned about it being that it has only been about 5 days.
I must say, I really do feel great! Even falling asleep is more comfortable than it has been in years (due to pain) and have been able to actually stay asleep longer.
Is it really true to say I have been "clean" though for 5 days? There is a slight happy buzz I get from the Sub. Anyone else get this?
My supportive family came over to see me on Sunday (my first full day on Sub) and they were all great and I felt really wonderful.
I still hav eto find a better Doctor, but its hard to make those calls when at work. I will definitly find the right time though.
Thank you again for welcoming me and making me feel comfortable here.

Dee
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Unread 05-31-2007, 01:44 AM   #18
RemissionRocks
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if you get a buzz you may be taking too much. my best advice to you would be to take the least amount possible, just enough to control cravings and withdrawal. you would be better off taking your entire dose in the morning, instead of taking them througout the day, it kind of helps you break the addictive behavior of constantly taking meds... unless you have chronic pain, you should be just fine taking your dose in the morning.

5 days? thats GREAT! yes you are clean! in my opinion, unless you're getting high like you did on your drug of choice....you are clean! you may get energy from suboxone in the beggining but it will probably go away. thats good you have a supportive family. i prefer going to AA or NA. its a great thing. if you dont like that, then therapy is a must. suboxone will not cure your addiction, it is just a tool of recovery.
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