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Unread 07-20-2007, 12:25 AM   #1
kyjobr
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Default can i start the sub now?

My doctor wants me to be in severe withdrawal before starting the sub but I didn't get the impression that he fully knew what he was talking about. My last vicodin was about midnight last night. So far I have the twitchy legs, running nose, sneezing, stretching. Not much nausea and I don't think my pupils are dialated (that's only happened to me once during cold turkey).

Question is: should I start the sub now? I had tapered down on the vics so I'm worried that I won't ever get into "severe withdrawals" but I still feel crappy. Doc said to wait 48 hours if I don't ever get high enough on the COWS lists to be considered moderately severe - severe.

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Unread 07-20-2007, 12:36 AM   #2
flier1
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You should be in at least 14 hours of withdrawl, that is what I was on when I started and did really well. Did he tell you how much to start on? I started at 8mgs and then waited to see how I did on it and about and hour or so later took anohter 8. But if I was you I would start maybe 4mgs wait and hour and if you are still having WD'S systoms take another 2mg wait an hour and so forth until the WD'S are gone and the cravings are gone, take care and best of luck to you and please keep us posted

Helen
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Unread 07-20-2007, 12:40 AM   #3
jmaugust
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My dr had me wait 48 hrs since my last dose of Hydros. If I were you, I would try and sleep a little then when you wake up, take your first dose. I think you would feel better if you waited as long as possible. My dr wouldn't even let me start 24 hours after my last dose, and I was even using Ultram for 2 days because I was out of Hydros.
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Unread 07-20-2007, 12:54 AM   #4
julie1129
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Hi Kyjobr,

This is my own personal opinion, but I think you'll be fine if you start your Sub now. You only have to be in mild to moderate wds before you start, so seeing you took your last hydros at midnight last night, it's been about 21 hours or so and I think that's sufficient as long as you're showing signs of wds. You don't have to be dying before you begin. But like Helen said above (hey Helen!), start out with 4 mgs and then go from there. What did your doctor tell you to start with? Good luck and let us know how it goes. But if I were in your shoes, I'd take my Sub now. That's just my opinion, though....

Julie
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Unread 07-20-2007, 01:14 AM   #5
kyjobr
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I took 1/2 my 8mg pill and I seem to be ok. I'm going to wait a while and possibly take the other 1/2. Thanks everyone for your quick replies. Why aren't you all in the chat?
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Unread 07-20-2007, 01:24 AM   #6
Hozz
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Kyjobr:

This is also only my opinion. I completely agree with Julie 1129. You only have to be in mild to moderate withdrawal. It's been said so many times here. 21 hours should be plenty of time.

I had no choice and had to wait almost 72 hours and felt like I wished I had died. Like Helen and Julie said; take 4mg (1/2 a pill) and go from there. You'll be fine. Don't go through what I went through, I wouldn't wish that on anyone. My opinion again, do what Julie recommends and take a 4mg now.

If you really feel like sh!t, I bet your in mild withdrawal and again, you'll be fine. All I can tell you in a few days you will be feeling like a new person.

Best of luck to you.
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Unread 07-20-2007, 01:34 AM   #7
cat1
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Kyjobr, You'll be fine if you take the sub now i woud'nt wait any longer,i waited 9 hours,started getting the drips yawning,stretching and i did fine and my drug habit was pretty big,dont put yourself into anymore misery,take the sub and you will feel good,i never heard of waiting 48 hours for a vicodine addiction thats ridiculus.

CAT
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Unread 07-20-2007, 03:34 AM   #8
Sandy23
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ive taken a pill then taken a sub. ive never experenceed prec w/ds but they suck ive heard. so to be safe ur in withdrawl so yea do what u were told. u dont have to be puking ur guts out to start sub. when i started sub i merely had a high bp and some sweats.
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Unread 07-20-2007, 06:53 AM   #9
kyjobr
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So I took 4mg's 17 hours after my last dose of vic's and was just fine. Took the other 4mgs a few hours after. Thanks all for the quick replies. I feel so close to everyone on this board even though I don't really know any of you. It's so interesting how a common problem/issue/disease can bring complete strangers together.
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Unread 07-20-2007, 03:35 PM   #10
barry
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Keep up the good work. My first day on Sub I took 4mgs in the AM and PM. On day 2 and 3 I had to take a total of 12mgs in three dosages. The Sub
completely eliminated any cravings I had and I had no major wd sxs. I noticed that my appetite was poor and I did not sleep well. I had a slight spasm in my right calf while on the Sub. I also noticed that I began to sneeze a lot. I can't remember when I had previously sneezed while on hydro.

Hang in there

Barry
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Unread 07-20-2007, 06:11 PM   #11
kyjobr
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thanks all! My biggest concern now is the high I'm getting from the sub. I'm hoping it will go away. I know that sounds wierd but I want to start living life without the buzz.
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Unread 07-20-2007, 06:34 PM   #12
Jloren
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Hi kyjobr...

I would get lightheaded for a couple of hours after taking my sub. Maybe that is what your feeling? I am on day 8 and the lightheadedness isn't as bad as it was the first couple of days.

JLonen
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Unread 07-20-2007, 07:08 PM   #13
kyjobr
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nope, defintely high. I would equate it to a very large dose of the vicodin. Itchy nose, jumpy, the whole thing. The addict in me is enjoying the buzz but I'm worried about how I will cope at work since I normally would not have been this high during work hours. I'm thinking/hoping it will settle down in the next few days....otherwise maybe I'll go down to 2 mg's. I'm just really uneasy with the thought that I might start chasing this feeling.
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Unread 07-20-2007, 09:36 PM   #14
pedenter1
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kyjobr,

If you are definitely feeling high, not just happy, you might be taking too much Sub. On the other hand, when I first started, after about 4 days of getting acclimated to the Sub, I definitely felt happy, clear headed and had all kinds of energy and excitement about my life. Frankly, I can't even remember what an opiate high feels like at this point. But if it doesn't settle down and you really feel "more" than just happy that you're off drugs and excited about starting a new life, and in particular, if it's making you fuzzy headed or drowsy or, I doubt it would harm anything to try taking a little less. But I'd give it another day or so - it does take some time to get used to the medication. And you can always call and ask your doctor.

On the other hand, if you real feel in jeopardy that you might end up abusing the Sub, try to take only enough to keep the cravings away, but remember Sub has a long half-life, so any change you make will take a while to feel, on the other end, you may still have quite a bit in your system from last night. You'll have 50% of the dose you took 37-1/2 hours after you took it. And I seriously doubt any good Dr. would be mad at your for taking less - that is the ultimate goal after all.

You're over the worst part now - you just have to find your personal maintenance dose and that does take a little tweaking in the beginning.

Later, Pat
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Unread 07-26-2007, 04:36 AM   #15
1dery
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Kyjobr,
I was just wondering how everything was working for you? I am still debating wether or not to call a Dr. and start this stuff. Thanks again for pointing me to this site, I have done nothing but read for 3 days straight. Hope you are doing well
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Unread 07-26-2007, 05:24 AM   #16
Fish
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Try 2mgs righ off the bat and then try more in aobout a half an hour???
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Unread 07-26-2007, 07:50 PM   #17
Sluice7
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by 1dery

Kyjobr,
I was just wondering how everything was working for you? I am still debating wether or not to call a Dr. and start this stuff. Thanks again for pointing me to this site, I have done nothing but read for 3 days straight. Hope you are doing well
1dery, <div align="left"></div id="left">What's the debate about? The fact that you've been reading posts on this site for the last 3 days should be a good enough reason for you to get started. Sub isn't for everybody, but it could help in saving your life,,, Think about it, what have you got to lose? I sure am happy, content and serene now that I have been on Sub..Take care and thanks for participating. Scott
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Unread 07-26-2007, 09:53 PM   #18
1dery
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Scott,
I Know I am just plain scared. I certainly felt alot of hope when I found this site...its just that on another forum Sub is getting a bad rap so I am very scared. I also feel like this is my last hope and what if it doesnt work?
Are the Dr.s generally understanding? I have the # sitting in front of me
And my other fear is the depression I feel when I am not on Hydro, alot of people state that once they started Sub they feel normal....well I didnt like my NORMAL feeling, that is why I abuse the drugs I am 40 years old and have been taking anywhere from 70 to 100 mg of hydro daily for about 2 years. There was once when I did taper down to 40mg but that only lasted about two weeks. Before these last 2 years I would use when I could but usually not for longer that a few weeks at a time. I have tried almost every antidepressant out there but no luck.Also I do have real pain issues, two bulging discs in my neck which are pressing on nerves. The funny thing is I have been on pain meds for so long now I hardly ever feel the pain, I know its there though because when I have tried to cut back I can hardly move..I only found out about the discs last week pretty ironic...rigth when I am seriously wanting to quit.
Thanks for listening to me babble and any advice about getting over the fears would be great!
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Unread 07-26-2007, 10:25 PM   #19
Sluice7
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1dery,<div align="left"></div id="left">'Fear of the unknown'.. That gets us all one time or another. I'm honestly telling you, from my own experience, that you should give Sub a try.<div align="left"></div id="left">Understanding doctors are abundant in this country. City, suburbia or rural. They're everywhere. <div align="left"></div id="left">This term 'normal', kind of gets to me once in a while. What really is normal? I know I feel just great when I'm taking Sub. It is just not as intense for me as full agonist opioids. And I could care less about taking Hydros anymore. What a relief Sub has been for me in my life. I'm extremely grateful that it came around when it did. Sub takes care of my pain, cravings and depression. Sub could do the same for you too. Have to try, though...<div align="left"></div id="left">I never check out those other sites. Don't figure there's any need in doing so. NAABT seems like a legitimate, fair minded and compasionate site to me, and that's all that matters. And most of all their integrity and honesty are far and away above reproach...So that's why I just stick around here, it's great for my sanity. Thanks dery, best wishes to ya,,, Scott......
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Unread 07-26-2007, 10:47 PM   #20
1dery
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SO do you think it would be better for me to call the Dr's in my area or try the matching tool from this site? I know this may be a silly question but can I get in trouble for not getting my meds through a DR. Do the Sub Dr's ask where you have been getting your pills?
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Unread 07-26-2007, 10:51 PM   #21
Hozz
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1dery:

I'm in total agreement with Sluice7. (Scott) I'm 48 and a former pain patient. If you have been reading for days here, go back and read Scott's or my history and see how this substance has allowed us to get our lives back. Normal does not mean coping a buzz or getting a rush. Normal is feeling how you felt when you were clean and 20 years old. There absolutely NO reason to be scared unless you are afraid to have your life back and things are cool as they are today. It's not a question of what you have to loose. It's a question of what you will gain. Life is a cost benefit analysis. Are you better off where you are today or is this chance not worth the cost? I wish you all the best. Good luck.
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Unread 07-26-2007, 10:56 PM   #22
Sluice7
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I would try the matching system and or the physician finder on top of the page. Suboxone.com has both, also. If the doctors ask where you've been gettin' your meds, tell them that Hozz threw them down to you from outer space!!!! Really it's none of their business. Best to ya,,,, Scott......
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Unread 07-26-2007, 11:33 PM   #23
cat1
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1dery, Why dont you just choose a doctor thats near you,i have the same problem as you i dont like feeling normal either,i love being high,but eventually the drugs will kill you,which is why i chose sub it really does work for the cravings and withdrawls so dont be afraid to try it,i was taking 40 painpills a day for 5 years and im in my 40s like you,eventually the partying has to stop or your life will.

CAT
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Unread 07-27-2007, 12:20 AM   #24
pedenter1
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1dery,

As for looking for a doctor - I'd do both. The best thing is to find one that takes your insurance. It also gives you a chance to hear from several Drs. (the matching system) and find out what their costs are, etc. Same with calling around.

If the fact that you had 2 disc problems that you didn't know about isn't enough to get you to get off drugs, I don't know what is. Obviously you are numbing your body to the point of not being able to feel when it actually is in pain.

Most good Drs. don't really care where you've been getting your DOC, they just treat the disease so I wouldn't give that a second thought. I would, however, give Sub a try, it has been a life changer for me and also I am lucky enough that it deals with my chronic pain. Also, some people do get a bit of an anti-depressant effect from Sub - but you might want to mention the depression to your doctor. You might need additional AD medication. I have found Effexor XR to be very effective for me and it actually helps the Sub with the pain relief effect.

Good luck and let us if you decide to start. There's always someone here to answer your questions.

Best, Pat
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Unread 07-27-2007, 12:43 AM   #25
1dery
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Thanks everyone! I know it has been said so many times before, but it sure helps to know I am not alone in this. I WILL call around tommorrow and let you all know when I will be starting!
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Unread 07-27-2007, 12:56 AM   #26
flier1
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Good for you 1dery
It is scary at first, but believe me the outcome is the best. I think that if you find a Dr and don't care to much for him or her there are many others. You will be OK and the best part for me is the time now that I have with my family I was such a loner that I confined myself to my bedroom for 4 years and when I would have to go somewhere I would have to sike myself up to it, but no more I get up and go, I don't sleep til 1 or 2 o'clock now I am up at 8 and start my day. It is the best.

Kyjobr
That feeling of HIGH will go away my first week I felt like that but after that I just felt normal. So I wish you both the best and keep us updated, also I know about the other sites but if you do your program right and taper down very slowly you should do just fine, a lot of people jump from 2-4mgs to nothing and they do feel the affects, it should not be done like that, so take it slow and easy

Helen
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Unread 07-27-2007, 01:58 AM   #27
Hozz
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So true Helen! I was sleeping till noon and now I'm up and ready to go at 6am. What a great feeling not sleeping all the time and I have that "refreshed" feeling when I wake-up. This substance is really amazing. And no more isolation and all that effort to go out with the family. I'm so ashamed that I missed so much. I'm going to make up for all this lost time I wasted. Take care and be well!
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Unread 07-27-2007, 06:18 AM   #28
kyjobr
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sorry I haven't been keeping up with the posts. On my second day of taking the sub my mother had a massive aneurysm and died so I haven't had a chance to keep up with the posts. I'm taking a very small amount each day and am still getting the "high" feeling. Still nodding off while driving etc. But I'm not craving vicodin! Even though I'm the minority (by getting high off it) I will still very much recommend the sub to anyone. Especially if you've had any relapses before by going cold turkey.
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