Addiction Survivors

Notices

Reply
Unread 10-28-2009, 10:18 PM   #51
Saint
Senior Member
 
Saint's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,364
Default

R.Lee,

I don't think I've seen the Bud Wheat commercial. Although personally I think it was the Wheat and not the Bud that attracts you. At your age you need all the fiber you can get to stay regular. I think you know that .

The commercials were all looking pretty good to me. Today not so much.

Wishing you and yours the best.

Regards
Saint is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 10-29-2009, 12:41 AM   #52
R. Lee
Senior Member
 
Posts: 4,984
Default

In my drinking days I would say beer was the perfect food. Barley & hops for fiber & pure natural water.
R. Lee is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 10-30-2009, 04:17 PM   #53
CarlyO
Moderator
 
CarlyO's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,566
Default

Hi Saint,

Just checking in with you- how are you ? I hope things are going better for you. Hang in there, Take care, Carly : )
__________________
Important disclaimer: Any information in this post is not and does not constitute medical advice under any circumstances. Addiction Survivors, Inc. does not warranty or guarantee the accurateness, completeness, adequacy or currency of the information contained in or linked to the Site. Your use of information on the Site or materials linked to the Site is entirely at your own risk. NEVER take any online advice over that of a qualified healthcare provider. Any information contained on AddictionSurvivors.org should only serve to inspire further investigation with credible, verifiable references sources such as your physician or therapist.
CarlyO is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-01-2009, 08:31 PM   #54
Magda
Moderator
 
Magda's Avatar
 
Posts: 417
Default

Saint-
It is at the most unpredictable moments that our urges creep up on us, and it could come from something so bizarre, so normal to most people.
Having someone who has been there in our lives makes a huge difference.If we have the ability to pick up the phone and talk about our urges- we may be able to put the beast to rest.In time, it does get easier. We must always be ready for it, and always aware that it exists eternally.
__________________
Important disclaimer: Any information in this post is not and does not constitute medical advice under any circumstances. Addiction Survivors, Inc. does not warranty or guarantee the accurateness, completeness, adequacy or currency of the information contained in or linked to the Site. Your use of information on the Site or materials linked to the Site is entirely at your own risk. NEVER take any online advice over that of a qualified healthcare provider. Any information contained on AddictionSurvivors.org should only serve to inspire further investigation with credible, verifiable references sources such as your physician or therapist.
Magda is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-01-2009, 09:27 PM   #55
Saint
Senior Member
 
Saint's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,364
Default

Magda,

Hello again. How are you?

Yes the urge to drink blindsided me. I was totally unprepared for it. As I mentioned earlier it wasn't an urge to drink. I couldn't put a finger on it right away, eventually I figured it out. I didn't want one drink, or two drinks, something was pulling me to get 'trashed'. That realization scared the hell out of me and left me unsettled. I got through it by reminding myself of all the reasons I do not to wish to drink.

I survived round one with the beast.

Magda - Thank you for the advice. I hope you enjoyed your day.



Regards
Saint is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-01-2009, 09:42 PM   #56
Saint
Senior Member
 
Saint's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,364
Default

Carly,

How am I? Well I just read your recent post to Frank and I am truly humbled. To read a story of such adversity encountered at such a young age, to persevere and overcome, to survive and be such a positive influence on other people's lives truly humbles me.

Wow! I hope you know true joy and love - you deserve it. Wishing you and your family nothing but the best.

Regards
Saint is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-01-2009, 10:16 PM   #57
CarlyO
Moderator
 
CarlyO's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,566
Default

Thanks Saint,
You are too kind. I have a lot of respect for this disease, the damage it does. I know many who have overcome far worse than I have. The insanity is that like most of us, I knew right from wrong, but when a chemical is coursing through me, I become very self-destructive. But, everyone has there own journey. I am grateful to be alive and to have a family- yes I know joy, last night trick or treating with my son : ) and not depending on alcohol /substances for my happiness and serenity.

We all deserve to know joy and love, none of us are bad people, and to anyone out there struggling, just please do Not give up. There are people you don't even know who pulling for you right this minute !!

Saint- keep pushing forward, you have so much insight and self awareness, this will benefit you, you are doing great and have so much offer all of us .

Take care, Carly : )
__________________
Important disclaimer: Any information in this post is not and does not constitute medical advice under any circumstances. Addiction Survivors, Inc. does not warranty or guarantee the accurateness, completeness, adequacy or currency of the information contained in or linked to the Site. Your use of information on the Site or materials linked to the Site is entirely at your own risk. NEVER take any online advice over that of a qualified healthcare provider. Any information contained on AddictionSurvivors.org should only serve to inspire further investigation with credible, verifiable references sources such as your physician or therapist.
CarlyO is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-02-2009, 12:24 PM   #58
Saint
Senior Member
 
Saint's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,364
Default

Carly,

Too kind, I think not. I would like to offer that perhaps we both suffer from the same disease - modesty ; ) .

Your story is inspirational, you provide proof that one can survive this disease and prosper, to once again know love and happiness. You provide Hope. For that I thank you.

Yes this disease is terrible and causes much pain and suffering for the addict and their families. Yet there will be tragedy in life, not just in this disease. All one has to do is look past ourselves and acknowledge the tragedies that have befallen others. Many not only survive, in time they also prosper and find happiness.

It is not the tragedy in one’s life that defines us as a person. It is how we respond to these tragedies that defines us a person.

Carly, R.Lee, Magda, Idol, Jerryg, - Thank you for making a difference in my life.


Regards
Saint is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-02-2009, 02:27 PM   #59
jerryg
Moderator
 
Posts: 525
Default

Saint,

Glad to hear you have been helped by the board! I am sure you have been a help as well as you seek to find your way to a sober life.

About urges and cravings. I am bemused when people mention feeling "blind sided" by urges to use. And yet they respond witha sort of surprise. Take those moments and humbly accept that this is noting new and do not attach a negative to it. Urges and cravings in sobriety can be seen as stress or some kind of upset that is seeking care. Yet the addictive logic directs the mind to using rather than attending to the need for care. Often the feelings beneath an urge need to be expressed so a negative fearful response may hinder that expression. Rather than appeasing an urge to drink, one must embrace it in a caring way, which at times may seem painful. But that pain was the thing the drinker has been avoiding all along.

FWIW,
Jerry
__________________
Important disclaimer: Any information in this post is not and does not constitute medical advice under any circumstances. Addiction Survivors, Inc. does not warranty or guarantee the accurateness, completeness, adequacy or currency of the information contained in or linked to the Site. Your use of information on the Site or materials linked to the Site is entirely at your own risk. NEVER take any online advice over that of a qualified healthcare provider. Any information contained on AddictionSurvivors.org should only serve to inspire further investigation with credible, verifiable references sources such as your physician or therapist.
jerryg is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-02-2009, 04:42 PM   #60
Saint
Senior Member
 
Saint's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,364
Default

Jerry,

Hello, I trust all is well?

I've got to say, I'm intrigued, as seems customary, on your insights regarding cravings and urges.

When people have spoken of 'triggers' in the past I assumed the trigger was in response to an immediate emotion or one which recently occurred. If I understand you correctly the 'urge' is perhaps a response to emotions that have been buried or not confronted in the past? Yes?

You mention embracing the 'urge' in a caring way which on the face of it seems counterintuitive. It begs one question from me - How?


Regards
Saint is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-02-2009, 06:04 PM   #61
R. Lee
Senior Member
 
Posts: 4,984
Default

Saint, Your right. Life goes on even if we are sober. Good & bad things will happen. I have to stay in the right frame of mind & realize that I'm not in control of people places & things. I may be concerned but I have learned to accept things as they are. I have the responsibility to do the footwork but I'm not in control of the out come.
R. Lee is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-03-2009, 04:09 PM   #62
CarlyO
Moderator
 
CarlyO's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,566
Default

Hi Saint, I hope all is well with you . You received some great feedback, very thought provoking.

Rlee - very well put, especially about staying in the right frame of mind so that especially early on when we face a challenge like an urge or craving, caused by as Jerry said an upset or stress, we are better equipped to deal with it.

Saint- Jerry is so succinct.. and spot on, I hope he returns to elaborate more on it !

this part struck me...
" Urges and cravings in sobriety can be seen as stress or some kind of upset that is seeking care. Yet the addictive logic directs the mind to using rather than attending to the need for care. " JerryG

I was remembering about how in the beginning of our journey when we are learning to cope with life without alcohol, ... not seeing an urge or craving as a "negative", because cravings, urges do happen, but we work on ourselves to deal with them, via support , whatever method works.

To me it is almost like rewiring our psychic hardware. Some people refer to it as a psychic change that occurs. And I think the REBT process you had inquired about could also aid in dealing with how one handles negative emotions that could be an underlying issue leading to cravings.

I did think back to the post where you described the circumstances that led up to the craving, being at dinner, seeing the wine glasses, the wine bottle, etc... People often grieve the loss of their substance of choice, maybe this could have played a part in it as well? I vividly remember feeling as though someone had died when I stopped substances , I longed for my so called friend and I did go through many of the stages of the grief process : denial, anger, bargaining , depression, and finally acceptance.

I know you are committed to doing this, and you are doing great, but I would be remiss if I did not post that if you get to a point where you are overwhelmed or that you're sobriety is in jeopardy - seek professional advice.
In the meantime, keep up the great work !!!

Take care, Carly : )
__________________
Important disclaimer: Any information in this post is not and does not constitute medical advice under any circumstances. Addiction Survivors, Inc. does not warranty or guarantee the accurateness, completeness, adequacy or currency of the information contained in or linked to the Site. Your use of information on the Site or materials linked to the Site is entirely at your own risk. NEVER take any online advice over that of a qualified healthcare provider. Any information contained on AddictionSurvivors.org should only serve to inspire further investigation with credible, verifiable references sources such as your physician or therapist.
CarlyO is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-04-2009, 09:14 AM   #63
Saint
Senior Member
 
Saint's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,364
Default

R.Lee,

How are you and the mrs?

Funny you should mention control. I've been doing some soul searching regarding my relationship with my wife and I've come to the realization that after all the years we've been together I was trying to control her opinions by trying to make her agree with my point of view - because of course I was right and she was wrong!

Well hit me upside the head with a frying pan and scream HELLOOO, ANYBODY HOME!

Needless to say there has been a noticeable decrease in tension when issues are raised. It's amazing what happens when I no longer try to control her opinions but accept that she is entitled to an opinion that differs from mine.


Regards
Saint is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-04-2009, 09:46 AM   #64
Saint
Senior Member
 
Saint's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,364
Default

Carly,

Hi - How's the Big Guy and the Little Guy in your life doing?


Yes Jerry is good - he cuts right to the quick and keeps me thinking - I like that. I've read his post several times and I think some of it is sinking in. As you said - I hope he comes back to elaborate more on the subject.

I believe you are correct when you say I was grieving. The realization that I could not enjoy a dinner as a 'normal' person struck me harder than I thought. I was grieving for what might have been and feeling a little sorry for myself and those close to me. I didn't have any denial or anger but there were some negotiations going on, definitely a spell of depression. I can admit I haven't totally accepted my fate. There's still a small thread of my being that hasn't let go of the past.

I am content with the steps I have taken and I look forward to the next steps on my journey. I have an opportunity to work on and improve my relationships with those most important to me and for that I am thankful.

Carly - thank you for the reminder to seek professional advice if needed, I appreciate it. Have a great day.


Regards
Saint is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-04-2009, 10:44 AM   #65
jerryg
Moderator
 
Posts: 525
Default

Saint,
Glad to hear my words struck a chord with you. I have come to realize in my experience that fear of relapse is a real thing and yet this is what must be overcome. Fear has a role to play as it gets your attention no doubt but it does not lead to a solution. It must be tempered with compassion and faith. Through it all staying sober is most important.
I have more to offer. Let me form my words a bit and I will post them.
Jerry
__________________
Important disclaimer: Any information in this post is not and does not constitute medical advice under any circumstances. Addiction Survivors, Inc. does not warranty or guarantee the accurateness, completeness, adequacy or currency of the information contained in or linked to the Site. Your use of information on the Site or materials linked to the Site is entirely at your own risk. NEVER take any online advice over that of a qualified healthcare provider. Any information contained on AddictionSurvivors.org should only serve to inspire further investigation with credible, verifiable references sources such as your physician or therapist.
jerryg is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-04-2009, 11:37 AM   #66
jerryg
Moderator
 
Posts: 525
Default

When people have spoken of 'triggers' in the past I assumed the trigger was in response to an immediate emotion or one which recently occurred. If I understand you correctly the 'urge' is perhaps a response to emotions that have been buried or not confronted in the past? Yes?

You mention embracing the 'urge' in a caring way which on the face of it seems counterintuitive. It begs one question from me - How?


Yes it can be an immediate emotion or response to some present stress. But we are often dealing with long standing emotional issues that can be projected onto the present experience. It is confusing.

If one responds to an 'urge' as an unwanted presence to be feared and eliminated you risk appeasing it by drinking or by some other form of an unhealthy response. So it may make sense to regard it as natural, given the reality of one's situation, in other words it is part of the addictive process. It has become a way of life albeit an undesirable one. This is what needs to be changed. Still that is easier said than done.

Is there a part of you that hates the urge to use and for that matter hates the addictive presence altogether? That response re-enforces the problem. The way of addiction is to separate and isolate parts of the personality to accommodate the presence of the destructive substance and behaviors therein. The process of recovery is to reunite these "parts" into the healing whole.

Addiction promotes an ambivalence to one's own life. To diminish the role of this ambivalence one must begin to regard all emotional experiences and equally legitimate, and welcome, though painful. It means learning to love and care for something that has become difficult to love.

One must replace appeasement with care. As though the urge is an unruly ill mannered child that needs to be civilized and redirected. One must not allow the unruly child to rule the roost, nor can it be eliminated by throwing it out. When you drink that is in effect what one has been doing. Taking a vital part of our emotional family and throwing into the yard, separating chemically it from is place and role in the family. It is part of the family, part of the self. Without realizing it the addict has created this situation and upon realizing this painful condition compounds the problem by responding with fear shame and guilt. This may be why early recovery can be very painful.

Embrace is a gentle word. And if you notice addiction is one of brutality.
That being said, you can begin to see what you are up against. This can be resolved but one must remain sober to do it. We realize how painful that is. Support is key. Meetings to help with the isolation, allowing one to be honest about in expressing their condition and feelings. Talk therapy, to help resolve unresolved issues. One may also need clinical medical help to actually stay sober. Consider all avenues. But stay sober through out.
And then there is the grieving process! Oy!
Hope that makes some sense.
All the best
Jerry
__________________
Important disclaimer: Any information in this post is not and does not constitute medical advice under any circumstances. Addiction Survivors, Inc. does not warranty or guarantee the accurateness, completeness, adequacy or currency of the information contained in or linked to the Site. Your use of information on the Site or materials linked to the Site is entirely at your own risk. NEVER take any online advice over that of a qualified healthcare provider. Any information contained on AddictionSurvivors.org should only serve to inspire further investigation with credible, verifiable references sources such as your physician or therapist.
jerryg is offline   Reply With Quote
One User Says Thank You to jerryg For This Useful Post:
Thank You (11-04-2009)
Unread 11-04-2009, 04:13 PM   #67
Saint
Senior Member
 
Saint's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,364
Default

Jerry,

That was a lot of typing for you....

Oy indeed : ) !!!

You make perfect sense.

Yes I hated the addiction, hated the addict in me. There was my public persona if you will, the person who had it all together. And of course there is the alcoholic that is me; that person I hid, or attempted to hide from others and myself, the times I couldn't look myself in the mirror.

Jerry thank you for your time and shedding light on this issue of urges and cravings. I will approach the next urge with a new found awareness.

Oy!! - I chuckle to myself evertime I see that. Thanks again.


Regards
Saint is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-04-2009, 09:09 PM   #68
CarlyO
Moderator
 
CarlyO's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,566
Default

Thanks Jerry, I am so glad you elaborated on urges, triggers, relapse prevention....
Lots to digest : )

Take care, Carly
__________________
Important disclaimer: Any information in this post is not and does not constitute medical advice under any circumstances. Addiction Survivors, Inc. does not warranty or guarantee the accurateness, completeness, adequacy or currency of the information contained in or linked to the Site. Your use of information on the Site or materials linked to the Site is entirely at your own risk. NEVER take any online advice over that of a qualified healthcare provider. Any information contained on AddictionSurvivors.org should only serve to inspire further investigation with credible, verifiable references sources such as your physician or therapist.
CarlyO is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-04-2009, 09:11 PM   #69
jerryg
Moderator
 
Posts: 525
Default

Saint,

A friend once equated the addiction mindset to Bruce Wayne/ Batman, on one hand he has this stable life as a "normal" millionaire but then he has this crazy secret life full of chaos and danger. He is addicted to it and we know how Batman's sanity always seems in question.
The addicted often feel like they live a double life.
Glad you like the Oy! Just trying to put a little leavening into the heavy stuff.

All the best
Jerry
__________________
Important disclaimer: Any information in this post is not and does not constitute medical advice under any circumstances. Addiction Survivors, Inc. does not warranty or guarantee the accurateness, completeness, adequacy or currency of the information contained in or linked to the Site. Your use of information on the Site or materials linked to the Site is entirely at your own risk. NEVER take any online advice over that of a qualified healthcare provider. Any information contained on AddictionSurvivors.org should only serve to inspire further investigation with credible, verifiable references sources such as your physician or therapist.
jerryg is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-04-2009, 09:28 PM   #70
CarlyO
Moderator
 
CarlyO's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,566
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Saint View Post
R.Lee,

How are you and the mrs?

Funny you should mention control. I've been doing some soul searching regarding my relationship with my wife and I've come to the realization that after all the years we've been together I was trying to control her opinions by trying to make her agree with my point of view - because of course I was right and she was wrong!

Well hit me upside the head with a frying pan and scream HELLOOO, ANYBODY HOME!

Needless to say there has been a noticeable decrease in tension when issues are raised. It's amazing what happens when I no longer try to control her opinions but accept that she is entitled to an opinion that differs from mine.


Regards
Veddy interesting indeed : )

Seriously,given the adjustment period, it is amazing how our personal relationships can evolve and grow into something better. You seriously have a lot of insight, may you and the Mrs continue on the path of understanding and mutual respect.

My guys are well. Still have Tons O Halloween candy left, I am taking it to the sober shelter where I used to work.

Hope you and family are doing great, sounds like winter is near where you are. Today was 80 degrees and sunny : ) but - we don't ever get snow : (

Take care, Carly
__________________
Important disclaimer: Any information in this post is not and does not constitute medical advice under any circumstances. Addiction Survivors, Inc. does not warranty or guarantee the accurateness, completeness, adequacy or currency of the information contained in or linked to the Site. Your use of information on the Site or materials linked to the Site is entirely at your own risk. NEVER take any online advice over that of a qualified healthcare provider. Any information contained on AddictionSurvivors.org should only serve to inspire further investigation with credible, verifiable references sources such as your physician or therapist.
CarlyO is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-05-2009, 09:12 PM   #71
Saint
Senior Member
 
Saint's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,364
Default

Jerry,

Still chuckling over 'OY'. I do enjoy the levity and appreciate it when I see it in others. It is easy to become overwhelmed, these are heavy issues being dealt with but for me a little humor lightens the load and helps keep everything in perspective.

I was just recalling when a beloved Aunt of mine was dying from brain cancer. She was everybodies favorite. She loved life and always sought out and made time for the many nieces and nephews. Shortly before she passed I went to visit her. My grandmother was taking care of her sister(my Aunt) who at this point was bedridden and unable to speak due to the progression of her disease.

My grandmother was sitting on the edge of the bed, communicating with my aunt through touch and eye contact. All of a sudden the two of them started giggling to the point my grandmother peed her pants (she's well known for that). Well actually just my grandmother was giggling, my Aunt couldn't vocalize but you could tell by her body motions.

A couple of 70 year olds acting 60 years younger. Bitter sweet but heartwarming none the less.

The power of humor.

Regards

Last edited by Saint; 11-05-2009 at 09:16 PM.. Reason: context, spelling
Saint is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-06-2009, 12:13 AM   #72
jerryg
Moderator
 
Posts: 525
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Saint View Post
Jerry,

Still chuckling over 'OY'. I do enjoy the levity and appreciate it when I see it in others. It is easy to become overwhelmed, these are heavy issues being dealt with but for me a little humor lightens the load and helps keep everything in perspective.

I was just recalling when a beloved Aunt of mine was dying from brain cancer. She was everybodies favorite. She loved life and always sought out and made time for the many nieces and nephews. Shortly before she passed I went to visit her. My grandmother was taking care of her sister(my Aunt) who at this point was bedridden and unable to speak due to the progression of her disease.

My grandmother was sitting on the edge of the bed, communicating with my aunt through touch and eye contact. All of a sudden the two of them started giggling to the point my grandmother peed her pants (she's well known for that). Well actually just my grandmother was giggling, my Aunt couldn't vocalize but you could tell by her body motions.

A couple of 70 year olds acting 60 years younger. Bitter sweet but heartwarming none the less.

The power of humor.

Regards
Sweet
Thanks
J
__________________
Important disclaimer: Any information in this post is not and does not constitute medical advice under any circumstances. Addiction Survivors, Inc. does not warranty or guarantee the accurateness, completeness, adequacy or currency of the information contained in or linked to the Site. Your use of information on the Site or materials linked to the Site is entirely at your own risk. NEVER take any online advice over that of a qualified healthcare provider. Any information contained on AddictionSurvivors.org should only serve to inspire further investigation with credible, verifiable references sources such as your physician or therapist.
jerryg is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-06-2009, 08:38 AM   #73
Saint
Senior Member
 
Saint's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,364
Default

Jerry,

You're welcome.

Regards
Saint is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-12-2009, 11:31 PM   #74
Saint
Senior Member
 
Saint's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,364
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jerryg View Post
When people have spoken of 'triggers' in the past I assumed the trigger was in response to an immediate emotion or one which recently occurred. If I understand you correctly the 'urge' is perhaps a response to emotions that have been buried or not confronted in the past? Yes?

You mention embracing the 'urge' in a caring way which on the face of it seems counterintuitive. It begs one question from me - How?


Yes it can be an immediate emotion or response to some present stress. But we are often dealing with long standing emotional issues that can be projected onto the present experience. It is confusing.

If one responds to an 'urge' as an unwanted presence to be feared and eliminated you risk appeasing it by drinking or by some other form of an unhealthy response. So it may make sense to regard it as natural, given the reality of one's situation, in other words it is part of the addictive process. It has become a way of life albeit an undesirable one. This is what needs to be changed. Still that is easier said than done.

Is there a part of you that hates the urge to use and for that matter hates the addictive presence altogether? That response re-enforces the problem. The way of addiction is to separate and isolate parts of the personality to accommodate the presence of the destructive substance and behaviors therein. The process of recovery is to reunite these "parts" into the healing whole.

Addiction promotes an ambivalence to one's own life. To diminish the role of this ambivalence one must begin to regard all emotional experiences and equally legitimate, and welcome, though painful. It means learning to love and care for something that has become difficult to love.

One must replace appeasement with care. As though the urge is an unruly ill mannered child that needs to be civilized and redirected. One must not allow the unruly child to rule the roost, nor can it be eliminated by throwing it out. When you drink that is in effect what one has been doing. Taking a vital part of our emotional family and throwing into the yard, separating chemically it from is place and role in the family. It is part of the family, part of the self. Without realizing it the addict has created this situation and upon realizing this painful condition compounds the problem by responding with fear shame and guilt. This may be why early recovery can be very painful.

Embrace is a gentle word. And if you notice addiction is one of brutality.
That being said, you can begin to see what you are up against. This can be resolved but one must remain sober to do it. We realize how painful that is. Support is key. Meetings to help with the isolation, allowing one to be honest about in expressing their condition and feelings. Talk therapy, to help resolve unresolved issues. One may also need clinical medical help to actually stay sober. Consider all avenues. But stay sober through out.
And then there is the grieving process! Oy!
Hope that makes some sense.
All the best
Jerry


Jerry,

I wanted to take the opportunity to thank you again for helping me understand the underlying reasons for 'urges'. It was truly one of those moments when everything you wrote made perfect sense, it all clicked, the lightbulb turned on, a watershed moment, etc. I was almost euphoric - which made me question my sanity : ). I've since managed to temper my enthusiasm. The work is mine to do but understanding is the key.

Thank you
Saint is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-15-2009, 07:52 PM   #75
CarlyO
Moderator
 
CarlyO's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,566
Default

Hi Saint- I think it is referred to as a "moment of clarity," a great experience for sure - I am happy for you !!

This is such a great thread- so grateful Jerry elaborated even more.
Take care, Carly : )
__________________
Important disclaimer: Any information in this post is not and does not constitute medical advice under any circumstances. Addiction Survivors, Inc. does not warranty or guarantee the accurateness, completeness, adequacy or currency of the information contained in or linked to the Site. Your use of information on the Site or materials linked to the Site is entirely at your own risk. NEVER take any online advice over that of a qualified healthcare provider. Any information contained on AddictionSurvivors.org should only serve to inspire further investigation with credible, verifiable references sources such as your physician or therapist.
CarlyO is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-22-2009, 11:43 PM   #76
Saint
Senior Member
 
Saint's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,364
Default

Carly,

Yes, Jerry's post certainly hit home with me. Every time I read it I end by saying to myself - WOW. Everything Jerry touched upon just 'clicks' with me. His explanation makes perfect sense to me.

I just read it again! I shake my head in amazement. Wow!

Regards
Saint is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-26-2009, 12:48 PM   #77
Saint
Senior Member
 
Saint's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,364
Default

Hello,


I just wanted to take a moment to wish everyone a Happy Thanksgiving!
Saint is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-27-2009, 11:34 PM   #78
CarlyO
Moderator
 
CarlyO's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,566
Default

Hi Saint !
Ditto- belated Happy Thanksgiving To All !

Hope you and your family had a great day : )

I am grateful we had nice Turkey Day and made it home safe and sound. Glad to be home and eating leftovers - Yum.

Take care, Carly
__________________
Important disclaimer: Any information in this post is not and does not constitute medical advice under any circumstances. Addiction Survivors, Inc. does not warranty or guarantee the accurateness, completeness, adequacy or currency of the information contained in or linked to the Site. Your use of information on the Site or materials linked to the Site is entirely at your own risk. NEVER take any online advice over that of a qualified healthcare provider. Any information contained on AddictionSurvivors.org should only serve to inspire further investigation with credible, verifiable references sources such as your physician or therapist.
CarlyO is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-30-2009, 04:33 PM   #79
Saint
Senior Member
 
Saint's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,364
Default

Carly,

Great to hear you had a good Thanksgiving!

I worked the holiday so we celebrated the Sunday prior. My wife and daughter as well as a family friend and their daughter travelled to NYC for the Holiday week. They had a great time, watched a musical, saw the Rockettes, Statue of Liberty, sat in the audience for a Good Morning America Show, went to Central Park to watch the parade balloons inflated and of course saw the Macy's Day Parade.

It was a great "girls vacation".

I swear my daughter grew three inches while she was gone!


Regards
Saint is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 12-05-2009, 02:58 AM   #80
LauraC
Member
 
Posts: 52
Default

Hello Dave,

I just finished reading your thread. It is filled with great information and real human heart. one of my favorite things about this site is you can express any thoughts and feelings and some one here will understand. That is very powerful to someone who is having difficulty.
I love how I always seem to hear something on these boards that confirms something I am thinking. Last night I was sharing at a meeting I shared that my sobriety is very precious to me. Like a seed I planted and protected and cherished. It can be very fragile. The bigger the plant the stronger I get.
Laura
LauraC is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 12-05-2009, 09:20 PM   #81
R. Lee
Senior Member
 
Posts: 4,984
Default

Keep growing Laura. You help me stay sober.
R. Lee is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 12-06-2009, 11:27 PM   #82
R. Lee
Senior Member
 
Posts: 4,984
Default

Saint, How is it going?
R. Lee is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 12-07-2009, 12:12 AM   #83
Saint
Senior Member
 
Saint's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,364
Default

Laura,

Hi - Love the plant analogy.

First year they sleep,
Second year they creep,
Third year they leap!

Keep that planting bed nourished, watered regularly, mulched, daily doses of sunshine and watch that plant turn into a garden!

P.S. You still have to weed occasionally : )

Regards

Last edited by Saint; 12-07-2009 at 12:31 AM..
Saint is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 12-07-2009, 12:29 AM   #84
Saint
Senior Member
 
Saint's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,364
Default

Lee,

Hi - I'm still kicking. It's been a busy week, I'll post more when I have the time.

Take care of yourself,

Regards
Saint is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 12-07-2009, 01:25 AM   #85
Magda
Moderator
 
Magda's Avatar
 
Posts: 417
Default

Hi there-

Boy, can I relate to being busy. Just finished another semester of school,only three more to go and then on to my next degree.It has been a great year for my personal growth and I hope it continues.Hope all is well, please share some more about how things are when you have a chance.
__________________
Important disclaimer: Any information in this post is not and does not constitute medical advice under any circumstances. Addiction Survivors, Inc. does not warranty or guarantee the accurateness, completeness, adequacy or currency of the information contained in or linked to the Site. Your use of information on the Site or materials linked to the Site is entirely at your own risk. NEVER take any online advice over that of a qualified healthcare provider. Any information contained on AddictionSurvivors.org should only serve to inspire further investigation with credible, verifiable references sources such as your physician or therapist.
Magda is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 12-07-2009, 04:25 PM   #86
R. Lee
Senior Member
 
Posts: 4,984
Default

Saint, Thanks for just checking in.
R. Lee is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 12-08-2009, 05:26 PM   #87
Saint
Senior Member
 
Saint's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,364
Default

Hi,

Well my wife told me she wants a divorce last week. I can say it didn’t come as a total shock but the pain is still there. I could see it coming but I was hoping to get a chance to repair and improve our marriage now that I am sober. Unfortunately for me the years of my active addiction and the accompanying behaviors, the lack of communication, isolation etc. has taken it’s toll on her.

I’ve had a couple of good cries, I’m dealing with the situation as best I can. It was a hard decision for her to make and I can tell a huge weight has been lifted from her shoulders. One of the reasons she struggled with the decision was in fact due to my sobriety. She didn’t want this dissolution of our marriage to cause me to relapse. She has also convinced me to see a counselor to talk about my addiction, emotions etc. I am certain that talking with someone will be of benefit to me. If left to my own devices I would have waited until my psyche was in anguish before I would have sought help.

I truly wish her the peace and happiness that I have been unable to provide her. I am also thankful, for without her we would not have a child that we both love and adore with all our heart.
 
Peace
Saint is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 12-08-2009, 10:36 PM   #88
R. Lee
Senior Member
 
Posts: 4,984
Default

Saint, That is a very nice post. It should also be in the Family & Friends section.

I was involved in a jail meeting tonight. 1 of the inmates said that a lot came down since the last time we got together. He was ready to cry. I asked if he could share any of it. Then he let lose. He calmly told us what has been going on. I thanked him & suggested that he should not be a secret. We all left the meeting feeling better.

Thank you for not being a secret. This is a tough thing for you to go through. It can also be a tough season to stay sober. Think through any actions & you will be alright.

Best of luck Saint. You help keep me sober.
R. Lee is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 12-08-2009, 11:28 PM   #89
Kam123
Junior Member
 
Posts: 9
Default

Saint,
Very sorry to hear about it.
Kam
Kam123 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 12-09-2009, 02:41 PM   #90
CarlyO
Moderator
 
CarlyO's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,566
Default

Dearest Saint,

I am sorry to hear of this news, though glad that you searching for some peace of mind in the gratitude of having a wonderful child together.

Did you know that she was contemplating such a decision, if you want to share ? Most of all, how are YOU feeling about it in relation to picking up a drink?

IMO - talking to a professional is a good idea, just be patient while trying to find someone that meets your needs so that you can get the most out the experience.

If you get ancy , you know we are here for you.
Oh Saint, I am just so sorry, but I have faith, based on what I know of you from this far, that you and she will get through it amicably, especially for the sake of your daughter.

Hang in there, sending positive thoughts your way, take care, Carly
__________________
Important disclaimer: Any information in this post is not and does not constitute medical advice under any circumstances. Addiction Survivors, Inc. does not warranty or guarantee the accurateness, completeness, adequacy or currency of the information contained in or linked to the Site. Your use of information on the Site or materials linked to the Site is entirely at your own risk. NEVER take any online advice over that of a qualified healthcare provider. Any information contained on AddictionSurvivors.org should only serve to inspire further investigation with credible, verifiable references sources such as your physician or therapist.
CarlyO is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 12-09-2009, 04:04 PM   #91
jerryg
Moderator
 
Posts: 525
Default

Saint,

I am sorry to hear of your situation. Your post was very bittersweet. And it shows a great deal of insight and compassion. Still it is so sad my friend.

Please stay true to your sobriety as you work through this. And it is good to read your insights and encouragements to others to do the same.
Again, so sad to hear of your situation.
Jerry
__________________
Important disclaimer: Any information in this post is not and does not constitute medical advice under any circumstances. Addiction Survivors, Inc. does not warranty or guarantee the accurateness, completeness, adequacy or currency of the information contained in or linked to the Site. Your use of information on the Site or materials linked to the Site is entirely at your own risk. NEVER take any online advice over that of a qualified healthcare provider. Any information contained on AddictionSurvivors.org should only serve to inspire further investigation with credible, verifiable references sources such as your physician or therapist.
jerryg is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 12-09-2009, 08:06 PM   #92
Frankie
Senior Member
 
Posts: 543
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Saint View Post
Hi,

Well my wife told me she wants a divorce last week. I can say it didn’t come as a total shock but the pain is still there. I could see it coming but I was hoping to get a chance to repair and improve our marriage now that I am sober. Unfortunately for me the years of my active addiction and the accompanying behaviors, the lack of communication, isolation etc. has taken it’s toll on her.

I’ve had a couple of good cries, I’m dealing with the situation as best I can. It was a hard decision for her to make and I can tell a huge weight has been lifted from her shoulders. One of the reasons she struggled with the decision was in fact due to my sobriety. She didn’t want this dissolution of our marriage to cause me to relapse. She has also convinced me to see a counselor to talk about my addiction, emotions etc. I am certain that talking with someone will be of benefit to me. If left to my own devices I would have waited until my psyche was in anguish before I would have sought help.

I truly wish her the peace and happiness that I have been unable to provide her. I am also thankful, for without her we would not have a child that we both love and adore with all our heart.
 
Peace
Saint,

My hats off to you getting through this without drinking. I'm really sorry. It's bad enough to split up, but being dumped is something else. It eats at you like nothing else.

Things still the same? Anything change? I feel for you man. Take care,

Frank
Frankie is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 12-09-2009, 08:30 PM   #93
Frankie
Senior Member
 
Posts: 543
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jerryg View Post
When people have spoken of 'triggers' in the past I assumed the trigger was in response to an immediate emotion or one which recently occurred. If I understand you correctly the 'urge' is perhaps a response to emotions that have been buried or not confronted in the past? Yes?

You mention embracing the 'urge' in a caring way which on the face of it seems counterintuitive. It begs one question from me - How?


Yes it can be an immediate emotion or response to some present stress. But we are often dealing with long standing emotional issues that can be projected onto the present experience. It is confusing.

If one responds to an 'urge' as an unwanted presence to be feared and eliminated you risk appeasing it by drinking or by some other form of an unhealthy response. So it may make sense to regard it as natural, given the reality of one's situation, in other words it is part of the addictive process. It has become a way of life albeit an undesirable one. This is what needs to be changed. Still that is easier said than done.

Is there a part of you that hates the urge to use and for that matter hates the addictive presence altogether? That response re-enforces the problem. The way of addiction is to separate and isolate parts of the personality to accommodate the presence of the destructive substance and behaviors therein. The process of recovery is to reunite these "parts" into the healing whole.

Addiction promotes an ambivalence to one's own life. To diminish the role of this ambivalence one must begin to regard all emotional experiences and equally legitimate, and welcome, though painful. It means learning to love and care for something that has become difficult to love.

One must replace appeasement with care. As though the urge is an unruly ill mannered child that needs to be civilized and redirected. One must not allow the unruly child to rule the roost, nor can it be eliminated by throwing it out. When you drink that is in effect what one has been doing. Taking a vital part of our emotional family and throwing into the yard, separating chemically it from is place and role in the family. It is part of the family, part of the self. Without realizing it the addict has created this situation and upon realizing this painful condition compounds the problem by responding with fear shame and guilt. This may be why early recovery can be very painful.

Embrace is a gentle word. And if you notice addiction is one of brutality.
That being said, you can begin to see what you are up against. This can be resolved but one must remain sober to do it. We realize how painful that is. Support is key. Meetings to help with the isolation, allowing one to be honest about in expressing their condition and feelings. Talk therapy, to help resolve unresolved issues. One may also need clinical medical help to actually stay sober. Consider all avenues. But stay sober through out.
And then there is the grieving process! Oy!
Hope that makes some sense.
All the best
Jerry
Hi Jerry,

Your words are making me think for the first time. I almost can't get my brain around it. The amount of painfull work ahead for me almost seems impossible. I don't know where to start, or really what to do. Thanks,

Frank
Frankie is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 12-10-2009, 07:18 PM   #94
Saint
Senior Member
 
Saint's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,364
Default

Frank,

Hi - as always it's good to see you posting.

You're killing me again! Geez I guess I did get dumped didn't I. I hadn't quite thought of it that way, or in those words but that pretty much sums it up. Whether you intended to or not those words brought a small smile to my face. Thanks for you being you.

Being dumped isn't eating at me Frank. Yes, it hurts but there are plenty of good memories. My wife has been an important part of my life for the last 25 years or so and she has helped me to become the person that I am today. When I speak of that I do not intend for that to mean she made me an alcoholic because that is the farthest thing from the truth. She tried numerous times to get me to stop drinking but as alcoholics due I rationalized and justified my behavior. She lived with my lie, that was a burden she carried by herself.

Frank I just don't feel the need or the desire to drink. I want to get through this on my own two feet, to cope with this with a clear mind. I wish to remain strong for myself, my wife, and most importantly of all, our daughter.


In regards to your post to Jerry you mention the amount of painful work needed 'almost seems impossible'. I think you realize it is not impossible and I also think you do know where to start and in fact took that step some time ago with your first post here.

All large tasks seem insurmountable at first. The way to complete a complex task is to have a goal. Develop a plan to reach that goal. Break it down into small manageable goals with your eye on the ultimate goal. If you get stuck or find yourself lacking the expertise needed to accomplish your goal find someone knowledgeable to assist you. Sub contract out the work, so to speak.

Your path to sobriety started with the first step which you've already taken. You just need to continue moving forward on that path, as I do.

Regards
Saint is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 12-10-2009, 11:01 PM   #95
R. Lee
Senior Member
 
Posts: 4,984
Default

Frank, Try & remember to take it 1 day at a time. 1 minute at a time. I may have got sober before I did if I took it 1 day at a time. It was just to big of a mountain to think that I could never drink again. So it took me a long time to try & get sober.Today I have a choice. I chose not to drink.
R. Lee is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 12-11-2009, 11:29 AM   #96
Saint
Senior Member
 
Saint's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,364
Default

Carly, Lee, Jerry, Frank, Kam

Thank you all for your kind thoughts. Your words do help to console and comfort me.

My hope and goal going forward is to make this transition in such a way that it causes as little distress to my daughter as possible. She will know that both her parents love her dearly and none of this is her fault. I have faith my wife and I will part amicably both for ourselves and of course for our daughter. Should my daughter learn just one thing from this ordeal it would be that two people can face their trials and tribulations with compassion and humanity towards one another.

I believe that a person is defined not by the adversity they face in life but by instead how they deal with that adversity.

Regards
Saint is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 12-11-2009, 02:49 PM   #97
Saint
Senior Member
 
Saint's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,364
Default

Carly,

Hi, to answer your question, Yes I knew for about a week and a half. She had told me she wasn't happy, that she wanted a divorce. We talked but at the time I got the sense she was on the fence. I felt I was getting mixed signals, perhaps we could work things out. She was feeling like she was the bad person, that everyone would think the worst of her for wanting a divorce, including and especially her family. She was under a lot of pressure, stress, knowing she was making the right decision for herself but feeling extremely guilty because of it. Understand that to this day I have admitted to know one other than my wife that I've had a problem with alcohol so perhaps you can imagine how she felt. She went to a counselor to talk about her feelings, shortly after she had made her decision. I know it's the right decision, I can sense, and see she is at peace with herself in spite of what lies ahead. It will be a difficult transition for both of us, and our daughter, under the best of circumstances.

We have agreed to inform our parents and families of the impending divorce after the holidays, together.

In spite of all that's going on, or perhaps because of what's going on in my personal life I have no desire to drink. I want to get healthy and strong mentally - and stay there.

Peace
Saint is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 12-12-2009, 01:07 PM   #98
Frankie
Senior Member
 
Posts: 543
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Saint View Post
Frank,

Hi - as always it's good to see you posting.

You're killing me again! Geez I guess I did get dumped didn't I. I hadn't quite thought of it that way, or in those words but that pretty much sums it up. Whether you intended to or not those words brought a small smile to my face. Thanks for you being you.

Being dumped isn't eating at me Frank. Yes, it hurts but there are plenty of good memories. My wife has been an important part of my life for the last 25 years or so and she has helped me to become the person that I am today. When I speak of that I do not intend for that to mean she made me an alcoholic because that is the farthest thing from the truth. She tried numerous times to get me to stop drinking but as alcoholics due I rationalized and justified my behavior. She lived with my lie, that was a burden she carried by herself.

Frank I just don't feel the need or the desire to drink. I want to get through this on my own two feet, to cope with this with a clear mind. I wish to remain strong for myself, my wife, and most importantly of all, our daughter.


In regards to your post to Jerry you mention the amount of painful work needed 'almost seems impossible'. I think you realize it is not impossible and I also think you do know where to start and in fact took that step some time ago with your first post here.

All large tasks seem insurmountable at first. The way to complete a complex task is to have a goal. Develop a plan to reach that goal. Break it down into small manageable goals with your eye on the ultimate goal. If you get stuck or find yourself lacking the expertise needed to accomplish your goal find someone knowledgeable to assist you. Sub contract out the work, so to speak.

Your path to sobriety started with the first step which you've already taken. You just need to continue moving forward on that path, as I do.

Regards
Hi Saint,


Sounds like you've got things under control going by your posts etc., but I still feel sorry for you, and hope things work out ok.


I noticed that you posted (again) that I'm killing you. I'm wondering if some of the things i'm posting are annoying you? What exactly do you mean when you say "you're killing me". Just curious.


Again, I hope things work out good for all of you. Take care,


Frank
Frankie is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 12-12-2009, 10:16 PM   #99
CarlyO
Moderator
 
CarlyO's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,566
Default

Hi Saint,
How are you doing ?
I am so grateful that your initial instinct is NOT to drink, so Kudos to you for the foot work you have done. Sure there may be some sad days but ... You sound good Saint.
I was thinking about how soon, you will be beginning a new chapter of your life, perhaps an adventure full of endless possibilities. Maybe make a list of goals - past ones that were not attained because of alcohol or new ones that you have come across. I know the ending of a marriage is not an easy time, but maybe this your destiny ?
In the meantime, I hope that you and your family will enjoy the holidays, at least when you have a child, it does make it a bit easier to get into that merry "spirit." In fact, mine begged us to stay home this year, so we have obliged him.
Hang in there Saint, thinking of you ...take care, Carly
__________________
Important disclaimer: Any information in this post is not and does not constitute medical advice under any circumstances. Addiction Survivors, Inc. does not warranty or guarantee the accurateness, completeness, adequacy or currency of the information contained in or linked to the Site. Your use of information on the Site or materials linked to the Site is entirely at your own risk. NEVER take any online advice over that of a qualified healthcare provider. Any information contained on AddictionSurvivors.org should only serve to inspire further investigation with credible, verifiable references sources such as your physician or therapist.
CarlyO is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 12-13-2009, 09:35 PM   #100
Saint
Senior Member
 
Saint's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,364
Default

Hi Frank, how are you?

No, I'm not annoyed with anything you posted. I apologize for giving that impression. I find the frankness(no pun intended) of your posts refreshing, and at times amusing to me. When you posted about getting "dumped" I chuckled at your Frankness(pun intended). You were "killing me" by being open and to the point(frank). If your name was Fred this would be a helluva lot easier and less confusing to explain!

So what have you been up to?

Regards
Saint is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off




All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:21 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
© 2014 Addiction Survivors